China owe much to USA after WWII.
China would never attack USA.
http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/brochures/72-38/72-38.htm
China would never attack USA.
http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/brochures/72-38/72-38.htm
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China's CNOOC signs $16B Gas deal with Iran, beginning of WW3?
- Thread starter Copernicus
- Start date
that's what Bush thought too.Quote from toc:
'we don't have any kind of strategic planning or military brilliance anymore.'
totally disagree!
military vrs military US can beat any force or combination of forces, within weeks or couple of months at the most. US can gain total air superiority over any nation including Israel, UK or France in a matter of two weeks and after that it is all smart bombs chipping away at the enemy military assets.
Quote from Tums:
China owe much to USA after WWII.
China would never attack USA.
http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/brochures/72-38/72-38.htm
I totally agree Tums.
However, that's not to say that China wouldn't assume the US wouldn't attack them. Saddam never ever expected the US to attack him, even when he took Kuwait.
He considered the US a friend because the US financed his long painful war with Iran for 7 years. And well... you know what happened, not once but twice. The 2nd time resulting in his imprisonment, vilefication and sentence to be hung.
Contrast this with the Emperor of Japan, Hirohito. His support of WWII cost 1/2 a million American lives. American prisoner torture, Death March of Batang, etc. His brother, the Prince, led the assault on Nanjing, where 380,000 Chinese civilians, women and children were raped, tortured and murdered in the space of 30 days. A war which resulted in 20 million Chinese dead due to the Japanese (compared to Hitler's 6.5 million Holocaust victims). A human vivisection lab that made the Nazis look gentle.
The US sent a Government representative to attend Hirohito's funeral. His son is Emperor of Japan today.
I know the reasons why he wasn't attacked, vilefied or sentenced to be hung. I just can't fathom why he was not considered worse than Saddam in every imaginable way. He wasn't even a US ally at any point before he agreed to bomb Pearl Harbor.
History is a strange strange thing.
North Korea and Iran didnt lose a previous war to the USA and sign a cease fire agreement which they later violated, giving the US the right to go back in and kick their asses. Apples and oranges.
The US went back in because Iraq crossed the line of the UN resolutions, what 12, times? It became a joke after the first time.
When Iran and North Korea violate cease fire agreements 12 times in a row, then the US will have a good reason to invade them, even if the UN doesnt want to enforce the cease fire agreements.
The US went back in because Iraq crossed the line of the UN resolutions, what 12, times? It became a joke after the first time.
When Iran and North Korea violate cease fire agreements 12 times in a row, then the US will have a good reason to invade them, even if the UN doesnt want to enforce the cease fire agreements.
Quote from hels02:
So tell me, why doesn't bloodthirsty Bush do something about North Korea and Iran's boldly announced (rub in face) WMD?
Since we're so superior, and we just fought a war over the RUMOR of WMD (false at that), wouldn't it make sense to actually go fight over the announcement?
Oh yah... we would be overstretched and have difficulty. Hrm. Why's that? We beat Iraq handily.
That wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that they were under trade sanctions for 12 years while their infrastructure fell apart? They had almost no weapons or technology to speak of (as if our intelligence didn't know that. I'm sure that was turned over with the report that they had no WMD by the CIA before the war).
We beat a 1 armed child, militarily speaking, and that makes us king of the heap. I agree. So why aren't we doing something about the only slightly tougher targets who are taunting us? (Iran and North Korea)
We can beat 'any number of forces or COMBINED forces'? Are you serious? Where did you see this?
Contrast this with the Emperor of Japan, Hirohito. His support of WWII cost 1/2 a million American lives.
Weve lost 3000 in iraq and the left wingers are crying for withdrawal. Thats like a little scratch under your finger compared to WWII. Thank god they werent around during WWII, or we'd all be speaking german right now.
The world wide appeasement towards radical islamist extrememists is getting pretty scary.
Quote from toc:
military vrs military US can beat any force or combination of forces, within weeks or couple of months at the most
except the Iraqi insurgency, you mean?
Yes, I know... if you carpet bombed Bhagdad for a month...
But then what? You think that would end the fighting? Eventually US soldiers would have to take territory street by street, block by block, sector by sector, town by town. I'm no military theorist but it seems self-evident to me that this would be the case.
Maybe you would say that the US hasn't really tried or that the military hasn't been given the right orders, i.e. enough guys and the mandate they need. There would be some truth in that.
Quote from traderdragon2:
Weve lost 3000 in iraq and the left wingers are crying for withdrawal. Thats like a little scratch under your finger compared to WWII. Thank god they werent around during WWII, or we'd all be speaking german right now.
The world wide appeasement towards radical islamist extrememists is getting pretty scary.
I can't really agree. In WWII there was a crystal clear reason for going over and kicking Hitler's ass.
The 3000 US soldiers and 120,000 Iraqi civilians have been lost because... because...
Err....
Also, it doesn't do your argument any good to claim that it's only the 'left wingers' that are calling for a withdrawl from Iraq. Plenty of Republicans are doing exactly that now. That bit of exaggeration makes you look like one of these moron partisans like ZZZzzzzzzz who will claim anything just to try to score a debating point.
Quote from hels02:
... China is no military threat to us at all. They're just a threat to our way of life if we don't wake up soon.
China is not the threat, US politicians are. As US politicians attempt to maintain their control over the world they will drive this country into the ground. It's already beginning with the current War on terror. IF they realize that war is not a viable solution anymore then maybe the US political process can be fixed. It will take at least 20 years to replace all the current congress since 98% get re-elected due to rigged election rules and I assume the average age is mid-50's. I'm not optimistic that the direction of this country can be changed in time to solve the many problems that will come from poor political decisons in the past.
- most of the ppl in China are pleasants and their avg income is ~USD450 a yr
- making more than USD15k a yr is extremely difficult in mainland China. Actually less than 5% of the population belongs to this elite group
- unemployment of fresh graduate is over 30%
- vulnerable bank system
- 0.5% of the population controls 60% of the wealth
All these describe the situation in China.
So anyone who really thinks that China has any intention of worldwide domination is simply paranoid. China's own preoccupation is to feed its huge economy instead of being a power challenging other countries.
To US the real danger is what will happen if China's growth slows down and the chaos caused. Thinking that China will buy US out or challenge US militarily is simply paranoid.
I am a HK guy working in the semiconductor industry and visit all major China cities regularly. The so-called market leaders are simply assembly lines with little R&D ability.
Maybe many of the ppl here hv visited Shanghai... but hv you been to areas other than the few big cities??? With such a big population it is relatively easy to make a few big cities. But the difficulty China faces now is what to do next.... how to feed/grow the other 80% of population/areas... Don't get misled by what you see in Shanghai or Beijing or Shenzhen. They don't represent entire China. Most Chinese are still utterly poor.
- making more than USD15k a yr is extremely difficult in mainland China. Actually less than 5% of the population belongs to this elite group
- unemployment of fresh graduate is over 30%
- vulnerable bank system
- 0.5% of the population controls 60% of the wealth
All these describe the situation in China.
So anyone who really thinks that China has any intention of worldwide domination is simply paranoid. China's own preoccupation is to feed its huge economy instead of being a power challenging other countries.
To US the real danger is what will happen if China's growth slows down and the chaos caused. Thinking that China will buy US out or challenge US militarily is simply paranoid.
I am a HK guy working in the semiconductor industry and visit all major China cities regularly. The so-called market leaders are simply assembly lines with little R&D ability.
Maybe many of the ppl here hv visited Shanghai... but hv you been to areas other than the few big cities??? With such a big population it is relatively easy to make a few big cities. But the difficulty China faces now is what to do next.... how to feed/grow the other 80% of population/areas... Don't get misled by what you see in Shanghai or Beijing or Shenzhen. They don't represent entire China. Most Chinese are still utterly poor.
Even up to 1500 China had the biggest fleet in the world, biggest cities in the world, etc. It was simply the superpower at the time.
But within a few hundred years China was reduced to a country bullied by nearly every western countries and Japan.
The lesson is that figures don't represent anything. There was something very wrong about Chinese culture... it is the quality instead of figures that really counts.
So what US should ask is not whether China or other countries are growing and threatening them. They should rather ask whether they are correct on more fundamental policies such as education, openness of society, etc.
US is wasting too much time/money on irrelevant issues. This is their real danger.
But within a few hundred years China was reduced to a country bullied by nearly every western countries and Japan.
The lesson is that figures don't represent anything. There was something very wrong about Chinese culture... it is the quality instead of figures that really counts.
So what US should ask is not whether China or other countries are growing and threatening them. They should rather ask whether they are correct on more fundamental policies such as education, openness of society, etc.
US is wasting too much time/money on irrelevant issues. This is their real danger.