correct, butbthe algos hft and members never deal with this type of operational constraint and memebers know when trading with members amd when nonmember orders are being placed. especially human nonmember orders. they are designated ckearly in the imessages. did you know you can pause your order just by starting to modify..without a cancel..
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CANCEL orders. The most powerful order never discussed until now!
- Thread starter REDP1800
- Start date
retail novice traders go into trading thinking. 1. it is a fair place to tradecorrect, butbthe algos hft and members never deal with this type of operational constraint and memebers know when trading with members amd when nonmember orders are being placed. especially human nonmember orders. they are designated ckearly in the imessages. did you know you can pause your order just by starting to modify..without a cancel..
2. the rules are the same for all participants
3. no one knows my order or cares about a 1 lot
4. clustering happens with retail 1 lot traders so cumulatively u worry about all those 1 lots especially now that all orders are reduced to almost 1 lot size
5. they think they are defenders of the rules since they are trading but dont realize that their firecest largest competitors have a huge advantage and different rule set as well as informational advantage rime advabtage money advantage and tech advantage and overall huge edge
i completely agree with you. cme should make them be market makers..mm but in the emini sp n naz futures there are no market makers..there are mm in the emini sp futures options thoughMy understanding is not a ratio. I spoke to member services at the CME 2 years ago for an automated client. No manual trader can hit 20,000 message units per day. Even an automated client that needs to enter that many orders just needs to register as a MM. It is about 15 orders per second. What they want to avoid is spoofing and those that do not add to depth and liquidity from using bandwidth.
Anyone concerned with this should contact the CME.
i wasnt manipulating at all because not one of my orders ever got filled and i didnt have any orders that were filled and open on the books. i was just making the limit order book look hilarious with all 11 at each level or 23 or 10 10 10 10 10...i just kept adding and deleting orders to keep the deck at 10 10 10 10 it was a challenge manually but figured it would help menget some muscle memory for trading liveRight, because it looks like market manipulation which they have systems to look for.
by live i mean..when i actually have positions that are open in the market. the acct is kive otherwise these orders wouldnt show up in live book. im curious what your thoughts are on the subjecti wasnt manipulating at all because not one of my orders ever got filled and i didnt have any orders that were filled and open on the books. i was just making the limit order book look hilarious with all 11 at each level or 23 or 10 10 10 10 10...i just kept adding and deleting orders to keep the deck at 10 10 10 10 it was a challenge manually but figured it would help menget some muscle memory for trading live
the sad thing is that once the regulators get a peek into the algos they will see just how gamed and manioulated this new microstructure system really is..and people will be astounded that the actual algos were geniusly simple. the quants are there to help the computers keep up with bandwidth and price n volume analysis..nothing to do with trading algos...that is simple manipulation. so ibcan build an algo..pay my 1000 dollar fine and spoof all day n night and if it brings down the mkt triggering a cascade flash cancel Mass Cancel event then the market gets crushed. people dont seem to realize that..investors in the stock market are gettimg more sophisticated and are waking up realizing just how fragile the system is and they are pulling out moneyby live i mean..when i actually have positions that are open in the market. the acct is kive otherwise these orders wouldnt show up in live book. im curious what your thoughts are on the subject
this is the reason the ipo market has been dead lately. why go ipo when you can get private funding without all the stress andbheadaches of going public. the public doesnt trust the market after these huge swings and traders shouldnt trust it either and for the most part they dont. also..did u see the cme has a ditect disconnect that cancels all orders of a firm or direct connect customer. the customer can hit a kill switch for any reason and cancel all ordere. orders cancelled are liquidity coming off the books. i miss the days of level 1 2 3 4 on the limit orde book in the eminis having 1000 to 3000 lots each! that was liquidity..but maybe that was fake too!! i never understood how this really worked back thenthe sad thing is that once the regulators get a peek into the algos they will see just how gamed and manioulated this new microstructure system really is..and people will be astounded that the actual algos were geniusly simple. the quants are there to help the computers keep up with bandwidth and price n volume analysis..nothing to do with trading algos...that is simple manipulation. so ibcan build an algo..pay my 1000 dollar fine and spoof all day n night and if it brings down the mkt triggering a cascade flash cancel Mass Cancel event then the market gets crushed. people dont seem to realize that..investors in the stock market are gettimg more sophisticated and are waking up realizing just how fragile the system is and they are pulling out money
the spread widens because limits are cancelled. duh
No. It is the market makers doing it because I see lots of orders lined up at the same price at lower prices on Level 2. It isn't like they are trying to even hide it! You can see it in plain sight. Common sense dictates to cancel your sell order and wait the very next day. Chances are good, the market maker will be on the other side selling those same options they got for cheap for way, way higher!
there are no mm in the equity futures!No. It is the market makers doing it because I see lots of orders lined up at the same price at lower prices on Level 2. It isn't like they are trying to even hide it! You can see it in plain sight. Common sense dictates to cancel your sell order and wait the very next day. Chances are good, the market maker will be on the other side selling those same options they got for cheap for way, way higher!
there are no mm in the equity futures!
I do not trade equity futures, only equity options. And there are market makers in the stock and options market. Do not know anything about futures as I do not trade it.