Can the U.S. declare bankruptcy?

[Same Lazy Element]

Just changing terms gets the job done.

Changing the terms is restructuring and is an act of default. So is skipping coupons or maturity payments, which is the only time when you US has defaulted in 1979 unless you count repudiation of confederate debts.

I'd say when the China issue gets very bad I would do just that! Fuck them and fuck the rest of the world.

Sovereign default is a huge economic calamity for the country since it can not get access to debt markets for many years after.

 

[Nine_Ender]

I'd say when the China issue gets very bad I would do just that! Fuck them and fuck the rest of the world. What are they going to do? For decades the west and east have been taking advantage of the US.
BTW, japan's deficit percentage of their GDP is worse than the US. They can follow suit. Hell, Russia did it...I would do this and local(US) bondholders could get some tax benefits, the outside world- Fuck them.

Of course, markets would crash, all sorts of havoc would spread like wildfire but from the ashes, the cleansed US would arise like a phoenix but of course, we would have to kill all the cadres of politkos who got us in this mess in the first place, reinstate the gold standard. That would happen somehow in the midst of the calamities that followed.

You seem to have forgotten how bad things got in the US when a few of your banks went insolvent in 2008/2009. That's a working example of how people's pet theories about global finance don't mean squat when shit hits the fan.

 

[Nine_Ender]

Changing the terms is restructuring and is an act of default. So is skipping coupons or maturity payments, which is the only time when you US has defaulted in 1979 unless you count repudiation of confederate debts.


Sovereign default is a huge economic calamity for the country since it can not get access to debt markets for many years after.

There would be a mass exodus of global oriented businesses and many professionals if the US government refused to be financially responsible. Your taxes would essentially become like giving Trump money to fight mythical election fraud. Oh wait, people actually did that .

 

[Same Lazy Element]

For the last time, China does NOT owe the majority of US' debt (I think I am going to copy this sentence permanently in a notepad. I lost count of how many times I had to post this sentence in this forum). It's the US citizens who do so you will be just fucking the American people by declaring bankruptcy.

Well, but do they? Total value of the US marketable debt is about 21 trillion. We have to take out the stuff on the Fed balance sheet (7 trillion) so that leaves us with 14 trillion of stuff in circulation. Out of that, foreign governments hold about 7 trillion out of 21 trillion of marketable US debt (so roughly 30% of total and 50% of the float) as per TIC report . Another fair bit is owned by US subs of non-US banks and treasury departments of foreign corporations. There you go, "we can fuck them"!

Debt Report: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/mspd/2021/opds052021.prn

TIC Data: https://ticdata.treasury.gov/Publish/mfh.txt

PS. I can't find FRED report on Fed balance sheet composition :|

 

[JSOP]

Well, but do they? Total value of the US marketable debt is about 21 trillion. We have to take out the stuff on the Fed balance sheet (7 trillion) so that leaves us with 14 trillion of stuff in circulation. Out of that, foreign governments hold about 7 trillion out of 21 trillion of marketable US debt (so roughly 30% of total and 50% of the float) as per TIC report . Another fair bit is owned by US subs of non-US banks and treasury departments of foreign corporations. There you go, "we can fuck them"!

Ok as per my previous post:

4% or $1.1 trillion dollars. For that, they can have the city of Detroit! LOL

View attachment 260184 (A candle for commemorating the June 4th Tiananmen Square massacre that the Chinese government has made a special effort to oppress this year in Hong Kong. As per the organizer, to still commemorate privately, one is to wear black and hold a candle in vigil on this day. Usually I don't do anything to commemorate this event, but if this is what they are going to do to silence people that have been allowed to govern themselves, well, I need to do my part)

 

[Same Lazy Element]

Ok as per my previous post:

Well, 1.1T/14T is about 8%. If you count non-state actors who are holding USTs in China, we are probably taking about ~10%. For that they can have both Detroit and Florida, no?

 

[zdreg]

For the last time, China does NOT owe the majority of US' debt (I think I am going to copy this sentence permanently in a notepad. I lost count of how many times I had to post this sentence in this forum). It's the US citizens who do so you will be just fucking the American people by declaring bankruptcy.i find it ironic how many people do not know this fact. Especially on trading forum

Is there any significance to this fact or are MTT (modern market theory) followers going to propound their usual thoughts (shout) that printing money doesn't matter as long as we owe bonds to ourselves.

 

[CopperOverGold]

The U.S. debt is now about 23.3T.

It's never getting paid back.

Can the U.S. declare bankruptcy and pay 10c on a dollar?

It’s the cleanest of a bunch of dirty currencies.

most armchair economists ignore the relative nature of everything. If the dollar is declaring bankruptcy, you can be sure there’s a global jubilee and the US is one of everyone.

 

[JSOP]

Well, 1.1T/14T is about 8%. If you count non-state actors who are holding USTs in China, we are probably taking about ~10%. For that they can have both Detroit and Florida, no?

No their total debt holding is just $1.1T so if US really defaults, they will get even less. According to this article, https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/what-happens-to-china-if-the-us-defaults-on-its-debt, all of the IOU's that China holds will be worthless. And that's it. There, China won't even get Detroit. LOL They will just get nothing unless they decide to invade USA to claim their $1.1 Trillion. LOL

(A candle for commemorating the June 4th Tiananmen Square massacre that the Chinese government has made a special effort to oppress this year in Hong Kong. As per the organizer, to still commemorate privately, one is to wear black and hold a candle in vigil on this day. Usually I don't do anything to commemorate this event, but if this is what they are going to do to silence people that have been allowed to govern themselves, well, I need to do my part)

 

[volpri]

For the last time, China does NOT owe the majority of US' debt (I think I am going to copy this sentence permanently in a notepad. I lost count of how many times I had to post this sentence in this forum). It's the US citizens who do so you will be just fucking the American people by declaring bankruptcy.

Yes over 70% is held by Americans and or American institutions.