Can a Graduate Degree from Oxford U help me get a salaried position in trading?

candletrader · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from NihabaAshi:

Excellent post...excellent.

I highly recommend FP print out this post...take it to Oxford with him...

re-read it once or twice prior to going to any social gatherings (parties, dinners or whatever)...

it will help prevent uncomfortable moments and probably make him a few more friends...

excellent post.

NihabaAshi

Great post... I totally agree with you... let's hope freedomfighter takes your advice...

cuda · Jun 2, 2003

Rolegario, if I had cared enough to post I would have only hoped it came out as well as yours did. Great post.

I'm having nightmares about the word Oxford.

FreedomPhighter · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from rolegario:

What's so amazing about this and other posts I've seen from you is that it's clear that you've already made up your mind what the answer is to your original question, and that you're only looking for confirming responses from ET members. Even when people who apparently know what they are talking about tell you flatly that an Oxford degree will not help you, you automatically discount their opinions and dismiss them as unknowledgeable, jealous, or spiteful.

This kind of selective acknowledgement therefore begs the question -- why post this thread in the first place? If you're not willing to accept humbly (and I use that word as sarcastically as possible) what people have to say, then you shouldn't be posting on a publc forum a question that's bound to receive a full spectrum of responses. If you've taken the time to read through other threads in this forum, you'll find that except for the occasional wisecracks, people here are actually genuinely helpful, even in the Career Trader section (where, incidentally, you still didn't realize you should've posted your second thread). ET isn't a paid service, it's a free public message board, so you can't be offended by the wrath that your post can incite.

You're clearly proud of what you've accomplished academically, particularly from humble beginnings, and you should be proud. However, being proud doesn't mean throwing your accomplishments repeatedly in people's faces; that's just being insecure. Hey, my parents immigrated from a third world country right before I was born, and I got a BS from MIT and an MBA from Stanford, but until this post I never found it necessary to martial my academic credentials out every time I posted (if I get wisecracks now for mentioning it, so be it). But you've managed to mention "Oxford" so many times that it would be easier to just make it part of your tagline ("Future Oxford graduate, which I hear is as good as gold, and, according to my boss, the best trader intern to have never made money!"). I shudder to think how often you bring up your accomplishments in normal conversation.

You're obviously young, and you've managed to be successful at school. But, as many people in the workforce will attest, success in the workplace is an entirely different thing (sorry, but internships just don't count -- the responsibilities given to you just don't compare), and success on the trading floor is probably on the extreme edge. Academics is structured, linear, and rational, where the brightest continue upward. Trading, on the other hand, can be unstructured, discontinuous, and often irrational, where success can be fleeting and even the brightest can see there lives ruined rather arbitrarily. It takes a thick skin (which you clearly don't have) and not a thick skull (which you definitely have).

Take the replies and move on dude. You've used up way too much brain cycles and ET hard disk space trying to hold your ground.

I had some free time so I thought I'd entertain myself with some of the responses I have had on here. You leeches can read into my original post to whatever great extent you desire and extract whatever "inferiority complexes" you wish from it (don't forget that it is your failure to succeed in trading which looks for such inferiority complexes in others). The fact of the matter remains, however: I asked a simple question which most people on here, out of PURE ENVY or plain IDIOCY, just couldn't bring themselves to answer in a positive way (and no, positive way DOES NOT mean "in the way I want it answered"). You people must be just too fucking STUPID to understand what my question was in the first place. Did I ask whether an Oxford degree would PREPARE ME for a job in trading? Absolutely NOT!! Yet I have all of these responses stating: graduate school cannot prepare you for trading.

I simply asked whether having a Pure Mathematics Oxford Degree on my resume would help me to get interviews for jobs in trading (i.e. am i better off with Oxford on my resume, without Oxford on my resume, or is it just the same either way?). Even Mr. M.I.T. didn't grasp the meaning of my question. He starts explaining how graduate school will not prepare me for what lies ahead in trading (WOW what a fucking idiot....was that my question?.... LOL)

So the problem is not with me attempting to get a particular answer to my question. But rather, the traders on here posting answers to questions I didn't ask. Something obviously pisses people off on here about my original post. I KNOW it is envy. I know that nearly every response on here reflects that envy. To be honest, were I in any of your shoes, I'd be envious too!

It's not that I think I am better than you.......I KNOW I am better than you! That's the bottom line. I suppose the disdain comes into play when you too realize that I am better than you. This is understandable.

By the way, how many of you traders made money in your first four months of trading? Doesn't matter since I am probably through with this forum.

I have used all of my free time and need to attend to more pressing matters.

By the way, New York University, my alma mater, is waay better than MIT in applied mathematics (i.e. the melding of mathematics and computer science). Just thought you might be interested in that since you are BS MIT grad yourself.

Also, you say your parents immigrated from a third world country but you didn't happen to mention what they do for a living. I hate it when people claim poverty but in reality know nothing of it.

Obeisantly,

Ditch · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from FreedomPhighter:

I had some free time so I thought I'd entertain myself with some of the responses I have had on here. You leeches can read into my original post to whatever great extent you desire and extract whatever "inferiority complexes" you wish from it (don't forget that it is your failure to succeed in trading which looks for such inferiority complexes in others). The fact of the matter remains, however: I asked a simple question which most people on here, out of PURE ENVY or plain IDIOCY, just couldn't bring themselves to answer in a positive way (and no, positive way DOES NOT mean "in the way I want it answered"). You people must be just too fucking STUPID to understand what my question was in the first place. Did I ask whether an Oxford degree would PREPARE ME for a job in trading? Absolutely NOT!! Yet I have all of these responses stating: graduate school cannot prepare you for trading.

I simply asked whether having a Pure Mathematics Oxford Degree on my resume would help me to get interviews for jobs in trading (i.e. am i better off with Oxford on my resume, without Oxford on my resume, or is it just the same either way?). Even Mr. M.I.T. didn't grasp the meaning of my question. He starts explaining how graduate school will not prepare me for what lies ahead in trading (WOW what a fucking idiot....was that my question?.... LOL)

So the problem is not with me attempting to get a particular answer to my question. But rather, the traders on here posting answers to questions I didn't ask. Something obviously pisses people off on here about my original post. I KNOW it is envy. I know that nearly every response on here reflects that envy. To be honest, were I in any of your shoes, I'd be envious too!

It's not that I think I am better than you.......I KNOW I am better than you! That's the bottom line. I suppose the disdain comes into play when you too realize that I am better than you. This is understandable.

By the way, how many of you traders made money in your first four months of trading? Doesn't matter since I am probably through with this forum.

I have used all of my free time and need to attend to more pressing matters.

By the way, New York University, my alma mater, is waay better than MIT in applied mathematics (i.e. the melding of mathematics and computer science). Just thought you might be interested in that since you are BS MIT grad yourself.

Also, you say your parents immigrated from a third world country but you didn't happen to mention what they do for a living. I hate it when people claim poverty but in reality know nothing of it.

Obeisantly,

Somebody get this guy a doctor!!!

axeman · Jun 2, 2003

Neener neener.... I KNOW im better than you...
Neener neener, my school is better than yours....
Neener neener...your envious of me....

Spoken like a true scholar.

Oxford will be so proud.

peace

axeman

Quote from FreedomPhighter:

I had some free time so I thought I'd entertain myself with some of the responses I have had on here. You leeches can read into my original post to whatever great extent you desire and extract whatever "inferiority complexes" you wish from it (don't forget that it is your failure to succeed in trading which looks for such inferiority complexes in others). The fact of the matter remains, however: I asked a simple question which most people on here, out of PURE ENVY or plain IDIOCY, just couldn't bring themselves to answer in a positive way (and no, positive way DOES NOT mean "in the way I want it answered"). You people must be just too fucking STUPID to understand what my question was in the first place. Did I ask whether an Oxford degree would PREPARE ME for a job in trading? Absolutely NOT!! Yet I have all of these responses stating: graduate school cannot prepare you for trading.

I simply asked whether having a Pure Mathematics Oxford Degree on my resume would help me to get interviews for jobs in trading (i.e. am i better off with Oxford on my resume, without Oxford on my resume, or is it just the same either way?). Even Mr. M.I.T. didn't grasp the meaning of my question. He starts explaining how graduate school will not prepare me for what lies ahead in trading (WOW what a fucking idiot....was that my question?.... LOL)

So the problem is not with me attempting to get a particular answer to my question. But rather, the traders on here posting answers to questions I didn't ask. Something obviously pisses people off on here about my original post. I KNOW it is envy. I know that nearly every response on here reflects that envy. To be honest, were I in any of your shoes, I'd be envious too!

It's not that I think I am better than you.......I KNOW I am better than you! That's the bottom line. I suppose the disdain comes into play when you too realize that I am better than you. This is understandable.

By the way, how many of you traders made money in your first four months of trading? Doesn't matter since I am probably through with this forum.

I have used all of my free time and need to attend to more pressing matters.

By the way, New York University, my alma mater, is waay better than MIT in applied mathematics (i.e. the melding of mathematics and computer science). Just thought you might be interested in that since you are BS MIT grad yourself.

Also, you say your parents immigrated from a third world country but you didn't happen to mention what they do for a living. I hate it when people claim poverty but in reality know nothing of it.

Obeisantly,

trader99 · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from axeman:

Neener neener.... I KNOW im better than you...
Neener neener, my school is better than yours....
Neener neener...your envious of me....

Spoken like a true scholar.

Oxford will be so proud.

peace

axeman

That's classic!! Haha! That' so FUNNY! ROFL. I almost fell of fmy chair.

Oxford is actually very good school. And even has a very solid math program. And FF should be proud, etc. But it's a bit excessive pride to go on mesg board and broadcast it.

Being an ex-quant, I've worked with people with some incredible credentials who are far more humble or don't think too much of it. Phd is the the norm int he quant world now. Phd in math, physics, compsci, finance, economics, engineering are like a dime dozen on Wall St trading desks and research department. So, an MA/MS math at Oxford is good but nothing that they feel like they should fall off their chairs and get on their knees to worship you.

Not, only is a phd of any kind from a top school is so common in finance field nowadays, that people don't even think twice. And it goes further, were you a top scholar or just a merely a very good one? Some of the top quants not only have phds, but their research were top notch with great publicatons even before they ever entered finance. So, I applaud you on your accomplishments but I just want to let you know that it's pretty common nowadays. Check out this link on a thread where I discussed this topic extensively already: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17944&perpage=6&pagenumber=4

As to trading, yes, having an MS in math at Oxford will help you land a salaried position at an i-bank. Whether you be actually doing trading or not is something else. You'll get a higher chance of getting hired if you applied to fixed income derivatives trading or exotics because they like math people more. Good luck dude. There's a lot to see and learn in trading and in life.

trader99

RichSohn · Jun 2, 2003

Queens College all the way!

Your tea sippin' skills will get you nowhere in trading!

GreenDog · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from FreedomPhighter:

I guess my reasons for wanting to attend Oxford are of a more personal nature since I am not from a wealthy family and someone of my social class doesn't often find the opportunity to study with the Queen's children (grand children?). I will only be spending a year at Oxford so its actually cheaper than the US equivalent degree; thus if I plan on going to grad school at all, then Oxford would be the best value. I've never been out of country either and look forward to English life. Finally, Oxford has been around for nearly 1000 years. This has particular significance to me also... Thanks

you are a certified nut-case! (but a funny one at that!).

Judging from the number of responses, I think there are people here who don't know this thread is a joke. (I thought it was particularly funny that Don B responded and extended an invitation to "intern" at the Desert Asylum!! Can you imagine?? an "internship" at that zoo! -- too funny).

carry on my good friend form Oxford

trend456 · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from GreenDog:

you are a certified nut-case! (but a funny one at that!).

Judging from the number of responses, I think there are people here who don't know this thread is a joke. (I thought it was particularly funny that Don B responded and extended an invitation to "intern" at the Desert Asylum!! Can you imagine?? an "internship" at that zoo! -- too funny).

carry on my good friend form Oxford

LOL

TGregg · Jun 2, 2003

Quote from FreedomPhighter:

I think you need a 150 or so these days.

It doesn't matter the raw IQ score. Mensa scores on the top 2% of the population. Originally, they wanted to do just the top 1%, but they fuxored their scores, so they lowered it to 2%.

What matters is the score on that particular test. Take me for example. I scored an IQ of 142 on one test, and 138 on the other (on the same day, one test right after the other). Strangely, on the 142 test I was not good enough to get into Mensa (97%), while on the 138 test I was at 99%!

So I've generally considered myself borderline genius.

Oh, and I got in of course. Lemme plug SouthEast Michigan Mensa here, they rock! And get to SOTS. Clearly the best regular event on the calendar.

Not that this matters to you FP. Losers like you tend to be quickly outcast, should you somehow get in (we've noticed that the braggarts have a high failure rate). I dunno about other chapters, but there are a couple guys in SEMM that can rock your world - no doubt about it. And I also know they wouldn't talk to you for more than 5 seconds.