Cain Says Christie Is Too Liberal

Quote from Samsara:

1) So you're saying everyone at Bear and Lehman voluntarily took a bullet for the larger conspiracy? And what are all the banks' capitalization today as compared to the run up to 2008? Higher?

2) There are innumerable ways someone who thinks all multilateral institutions are part of a world government that will herald the anti-Christ can screw things up. Taking a belligerent foreign policy stance with China, knocking us back another 50 years in diplomatic relations, is one. Raising the stakes with Iran militarily and refusing to build a coalition with other governments is another.

You're making some interesting points. I think you see Bachmann as possibly a Bush on steroids, using foreign policy and the military to evangelicize or fight some vague "evil." Who knows, but I just don't get that sense of her. I was impressed by her answer at a debate that we should get out of Afghanistan past haste. Part of it was on financial grounds, but perhaps part of it was also a recognition that we have no business mucking around in muslim countries trying to turn them into Switzerland.

The rest of the field scares me even more on foreign policy. There is Ron Paul, bless his heart, who I agree with largely on the need to pull back from all our entanglements, but I fear that is the sort of thng you have to do incrementally and nuance doesn't seem to be his strong point. Except for Gary Johnson and maybe Cain, the others seem more or less to still be sipping the neo-con koolaid. Santorum is upfront about it, Perry does not seem like a guy who would challenge the brass, neither does Romney and I can only imagine what kind of multinational fiascos Huntsman would get us into. He's a big thinker, after all. And Gingrich is so all over the place, who knows what he would do.

So I am left with Bachmann, who has certainly not said anything provocative about attacking Iran, etc.
 
Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

You're making some interesting points. I think you see Bachmann as possibly a Bush on steroids, using foreign policy and the military to evangelicize or fight some vague "evil." Who knows, but I just don't get that sense of her. I was impressed by her answer at a debate that we should get out of Afghanistan past haste. Part of it was on financial grounds, but perhaps part of it was also a recognition that we have no business mucking around in muslim countries trying to turn them into Switzerland.

The rest of the field scares me even more on foreign policy. There is Ron Paul, bless his heart, who I agree with largely on the need to pull back from all our entanglements, but I fear that is the sort of thng you have to do incrementally and nuance doesn't seem to be his strong point. Except for Gary Johnson and maybe Cain, the others seem more or less to still be sipping the neo-con koolaid. Santorum is upfront about it, Perry does not seem like a guy who would challenge the brass, neither does Romney and I can only imagine what kind of multinational fiascos Huntsman would get us into. He's a big thinker, after all. And Gingrich is so all over the place, who knows what he would do.

So I am left with Bachmann, who has certainly not said anything provocative about attacking Iran, etc.

Yes, I do see her like that, but I could be wrong. For instance, I didn't know her position on Afghanistan. Actually, given that she probably does accord more with a Tea Party sense about foreign policy. But there's a huge element to our soft power with foreign policy as well, and I would not expect her above all the other candidates to willingly work well with others. I think it's particularly important to maintain good relations with China and India, not see them as pure competitors or emissaries of a world order.

I'd agree with your take on all the rest. Ron Paul, I've wanted to like for a long time, and I resonate with a lot of his positions. I agree that he'd probably too radical and deliver some big shocks to how the country operates. Plus, I do believe in problems like negative externalities, market power, misaligned incentives, and oligopoly that I do not think the free market can ever effectively "regulate". Paul is a purist, and in those areas (like with all the candidates), I think his policies could cause harm.

Given that, I can see why some might like Bachmann better. I've read about her intellectual training though and I cannot trust her objectivity.
 
Quote from Samsara:

1) So you're saying everyone at Bear and Lehman voluntarily took a bullet for the larger conspiracy? And what are all the banks' capitalization today as compared to the run up to 2008? Higher?

2) There are innumerable ways someone who thinks all multilateral institutions are part of a world government that will herald the anti-Christ can screw things up. Taking a belligerent foreign policy stance with China, knocking us back another 50 years in diplomatic relations, is one. Raising the stakes with Iran militarily and refusing to build a coalition with other governments is another.

1)No, i am not saying that, read my post again . lehman and bear were not among the chosen ones, that's all.

2) it would be very naive to think that China or Iran will actually compromise. Do you know of any examples of China or Iran gave up something to be closer to USA ? I don't know any..
 
Quote from Hombre:

1)No, i am not saying that, read my post again . lehman and bear were not among the chosen ones, that's all.

2) it would be very naive to think that China or Iran will actually compromise. Do you know of any examples of China or Iran gave up something to be closer to USA ? I don't know any..

Well let's explore your theory of how the crisis was engineered then. Did someone force Bear and Lehman to amp up their risk exposure on their CDOs? Did someone force AIG to insure these leveraged instruments? Or did these institutions simply not understand the products they were seeking to profit from and were acting on short term, bonus-driven incentives?

And you never answered my question about all of the chosen banks' capitalization. Where are their stocks trading today? Where did this windfall of profit go?
 
Quote from Spiker:

nah.. he didn't put me on ignore. I tested him and he replied, between you and me i bet you i can make him kneel .

You are most certainly welcome to try. If these types of posts are the best you can muster, then you may find yourself a tad outmatched.
 
Quote from Samsara:

Well let's explore your theory of how the crisis was engineered then. Did someone force Bear and Lehman to amp up their risk exposure on their CDOs? Did someone force AIG to insure these leveraged instruments? Or did these institutions simply not understand the products they were seeking to profit from and were acting on short term, bonus-driven incentives?

And you never answered my question about all of the chosen banks' capitalization. Where are their stocks trading today? Where did this windfall of profit go?

Oh, they didn't understand the products they were selling to pension funds etc,etc, that is a gem.

banks are better capitalized because they got bailout money , therefore bailout was a good thing?
 
So you think Bear, Lehman and AIG understood those instruments and intentionally bankrupted themselves? You think Dick Fuld intentionally wiped himself out? :confused:

Quote from Hombre:

Oh, they didn't understand the products they were selling to pension funds etc,etc, that is a gem.
 
Quote from Max E. Pad:

So you think Bear, Lehman and AIG understood those instruments and intentionally bankrupted themselves? You think Dick Fuld intentionally wiped himself out? :confused:

No, but those were not the guys who manufactured the whole scheme. Some guys made billions, those are the ones who caused it, not he guys who lost their ass. Get it now?
 
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