"Budget" build gone wrong

jprad · Jun 20, 2011

Quote from bighog:

But you are missing the finer points of what i described about cards that were designed for the financial Industry. Do you recall that i said buy QUALITY parts? Price is mox-nix, i want reliability, stability. The "DRIVERS" are engineeded for the card to perform in the proper setting.

No, the cards were not "designed for the financial industry."

History
The Quadro line of GPU cards emerged in an effort at market segmentation by NVIDIA. In introducing Quadro, NVIDIA was able to charge a premium for essentially the same graphics hardware in professional markets, and direct resources to properly serve the needs of those markets. To differentiate their offerings, NVIDIA used driver software and firmware to enable features vital to segments of the workstation market; e.g., high performance anti-aliased lines and two-sided lighting were reserved for the Quadro product. In addition, improved support through a certified driver program was put in place. These features were of little value in the gaming markets that NVIDIA's products already sold to, but prevented high end customers from using the less expensive products.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_Quadro#History

The drivers were also not "engineered" for the card. NVidia moved to a Unified Driver Architecture (UDA) over 8 years ago. This is from technical brief written in 2003 on the differences between the Quadro and GeForce line of products, pg 18:

"One of the most revolutionary and significant benefits offered with NVIDIAâs professional workstation and consumer GPU families is the NVIDIA Unified Driver Architecture (UDA). The UDA lets one set of drivers be used across the entire range of NVIDIA products including consumer and workstation products."
http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro_geforce.html

As for financial software, here's a link to the certified driver listing, not a single financial application is listed:
http://www.nvidia.com/page/partner_certified_drivers.html

Here's a list of their application software partners, again, not a single financial application vendor is listed:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/workstation_software_partners.html

When it comes to the NVS line specifically there are two features, Mosaic and nView. Neither of them are specific to financial applications. The bezel correction in Mosaic is pointless for trading and I doubt that many traders are using the virtual screens that nView provides either.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/desktop-nvs.html

Fact of the matter is that the NVS series of cards use GPUs that have been around for several years. The G98, which is in the 295 and 400 series cards first appeared in the 8300GS in mid '07 while the GT218 that's in the "new" NVS 300 first appeared in the G200 back in late '09.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Nvidia_graphics_processing_units

All you're getting for the extra money you've spent is the same drivers that run on dated, underperforming hardware...

LEAPup · Jun 20, 2011

I'm now lost.

Back to the drawing board for me after going through this thread. I had built an 8 monitor setup with the advice of bolimomo, scat, and a few others literally from the components they pointed out. The guy who built it, did it in front of me on a Saturday, and it was pretty cool seeing how a guy who worked for dell at one time installing componets on the line, a former "geek squad" team leader for four years (kinda funny as he rides Harleys, and looks like it. Lol), and a full time internet cafe owner/repair/builder guy put together the parts for my office setup. He's not cheap, but the work is stunning.

I was just wanting to go cheaper this time since it's a home setup, and a long time mentor/Friend told me I would be nuts to go from what I'm in front of Monday-Friday to a "completely foreign" setup. I have to agree. This is something I take very seriously vs. something I may go a little cheaper on like a car, new television, etc.,

I can pull off what I'm used to doing on 8 monitors Mon-Fri with six 24" (1920x1200 are what I'm wanting) monitors at home, on the days I stay home with no appointments.

I was wondering why this time I was having a harder time pulling the trigger on what I need to get the job done? Guess I've made this thread too complicated, as the last time I simply wrote down the parts recommended, called newegg, etc., and ordered the pieces. i.e., kept it simple. I apologize for not keeping it simple, and to the point earlier.

Here's what I've deciding to do. My Harley-riding, "computer builder/guru" can build what I need. I had good luck the last time (minus a few back and forth shipments due to two faulty pieces

), but overall, it worked out well. If you guys would give me advice on each piece you would order (basically creating a turnkey setup) that will drive six 24" 1920x1200 monitors that is lower on the noise end, is very fast, and reliable, I'd GREATLY appreciate it!

I'm wanting to cool with liquid, and run an i7-2600cpu, a 1200-1500 power supply, 8gb ram, ssd, 1TB, good power backup, the best cards for running six 2 dimentional monitors (I don't need 3d as I don't do any gaming), etc., basically everything you would recommend as I can take care of ordering the monitors, cables, and monitor stand. This will be a "from the case up" build for me.

Tall task, and I'll really appreciate all of your thoughts and recommendations! Guess this could be a build you could do without having to spend any money, but getting feedback on the results as I post them. I'm planning on taking pics of the build, and posting them in a "six monitor" or something like that build thread as a way to pay you guys back for the advice. My computer builder said he didn't mind that at all, as he wants to put the pics I take on his site (for advertising, of course.)

I look forward to the opinions and recommendations

jprad · Jun 20, 2011

Quote from LEAPup:

I look forward to the opinions and recommendations

You don't need water cooling for an i7-2600K and I already gave you a link to a configuration that will give you want you asked for, you just need to have someone build it for you.

LEAPup · Jun 20, 2011

Quote from jprad:

You don't need water cooling for an i7-2600K and I already gave you a link to a configuration that will give you want you asked for, you just need to have someone build it for you.

I didn't know that. I was wanting to make sure there were no problems with heat, and had been told that the water cooling setups (when set up with the right stuff), are superior. I appreciate the advice, as that will save me $ if I don't need it.

Bolimomo · Jun 20, 2011

Quote from LEAPup:

.....
Here's what I've deciding to do. My Harley-riding, "computer builder/guru" can build what I need. I had good luck the last time (minus a few back and forth shipments due to two faulty pieces ), but overall, it worked out well. If you guys would give me advice on each piece you would order (basically creating a turnkey setup) that will drive six 24" 1920x1200 monitors that is lower on the noise end, is very fast, and reliable, I'd GREATLY appreciate it!

I have 2 tried-and-true configurations which are in use today (model T: over 1 year; model U: about 4 months) with no issues:

Model T:
- ASUS P6T motherboard (3 x PCIe X16 slots, can drive 6 monitors with 3 PNY 8400 GS dual-head cards)
- Intel i7-930 processor
- 6GB of RAM

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=195662&perpage=6&pagenumber=1

Model U:
- MSI Bigbang Xpower motherboard (6 x PCIe X16 slots - but only worked with 4 dual-cards without issue, can drive 8 monitors with 4 PNY 8400 GS dual-head cards)
- Intel i7-950 processor
- 6GB of RAM

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=195662&perpage=6&pagenumber=21

These are based on the older Intel processors. While they are still valid, it is advisable to get a second generation intel processor (i7-2600k) and a motherboard that supports it to build your new box.

I too don't think water-cooling is all that necessary. But do recommend buying a good CPU heat sink (about $40 or so) to use in place of the Intel "default" heat sink.

Maybe like this motherboard?

MSI Big Bang Marshal P67+Hydra motherboard

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/284691-30-bang-marshal-hydra-motherboard

Advice:

- Pick the processor
- Pick the motherboard (note the number of PCIe X16 slots needed)

the rest can easily fall into play.

jprad · Jun 20, 2011

Quote from LEAPup:

I didn't know that. I was wanting to make sure there were no problems with heat, and had been told that the water cooling setups (when set up with the right stuff), are superior. I appreciate the advice, as that will save me $ if I don't need it.

If you were using a 135w first generation i7 along with 3 high-end video cards, then yes, water cooling would be the way to go.

But, the 2600K at 95w is about 30% cooler. It also manages the cores dynamically, so it will use even less power and generate less heat as a result.

The video cards are fanless and will draw around 75w when pushed hard. For what you're planning to do they should only draw 40w max.

Because of that you won't need a 1200w PS, the 850w will do fine and will not generate a lot of noise or heat.

I've added 4 Noctua fans to the configuration and swapped the Thermalright heatsink for a Noctua D14. Swap out the fans that come with the case and add two more to the front and you will have a very quiet running computer.

http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=16534345

Scataphagos · Jun 21, 2011

Good deal on Dell T3500 w/W3690 CPU.... (W3690 is current top dog in performance)

$1219 at Dell outlet. CPU alone is $1085 at Newegg.

LEAPup · Jun 21, 2011

Quote from Scataphagos:

Good deal on Dell T3500 w/W3690 CPU.... (W3690 is current top dog in performance)

$1219 at Dell outlet. CPU alone is $1085 at Newegg.

WOW! That sounds like a deal on a dell. (I made a funny)
Where did you find this? I've looked around everywhere are the only ones I'm finding are the $3,000+ 3500's with the w3690.

Scataphagos · Jun 21, 2011

Quote from LEAPup:

WOW! That sounds like a deal on a dell. (I made a funny)
Where did you find this? I've looked around everywhere are the only ones I'm finding are the $3,000+ 3500's with the w3690.

At the Dell Outlet site.. just checked, still there.

If I needed a computer, I'd buy it myself.

Bolimomo · Jun 21, 2011

Quote from LEAPup:

Where did you find this? I've looked around everywhere are the only ones I'm finding are the $3,000+ 3500's with the w3690.

Outlet or not outlet... have you finalized your video requirements? Still 6 monitors?

Per T3500 specs sheet:

=====
Video Card
Support for 2 PCI Express x16 Gen 2 graphics cards up to 150 watts (total) including:
(.....)
All graphics cards support dual monitor configurations.
=====

Have you figured out what video cards to use?