Bright Trading's new payout model

[kinggyppo]

Quote from Maverick74:

Lights calm down man. No more coffee this morning for you. Look, I really think you do not understand how this business works. Ok, those numbers you are throwing at me, I know how guys on ET like to get a hard on when they hear them but the truth is, those numbers are really rather bland. When you look at their actual return on capital, they are making fractions of a percent a day. Probably half a percent, maybe a quarter. I know a lot of guys that consistently make a 1/4 to 1/2 a percent a day.

The only difference is size. These banks have billions to work with. The numbers are not as sexy as the media makes them out to be. Yes, they are consistent. But that consistency really is analogous to an option premium seller which is synthetically what their p&l profile looks like. Very small consistent profits when markets are slow and calm followed by huge drawdowns when volatility explodes. There is nothing really new here. I still don't know what your gripe is.

You left out the bailout for these large institutions, ie socialized losses. None of this is new information, the problem with human beings is that our hindsight is perfect, should LEH with all its flaws have been bailed as opposed to GS or Bear, that really gets to the heart of it; politics trumps money at a certain point but they are so close its hard to tell them apart.

 

[EdgeHunter]

Quote from Lights:

All you do is play dumb and gawk and provoke.

No, Mav is articulate, logical and clear... I am using a street smart translator to try to understand your posts...

Your posts are are really whacky and unclear... maybe try again next year ...

 

[Lights]

Whatever man, he lives to torture Don Bright and nitpick at a firm he wish he managed. And when something's reciprocated back to him, he obfuscates stupidity. Just an observation.

Quote from EdgeHunter:

No, Mav is articulate, logical and clear... I am using a street smart translator to try to understand your posts...

Your posts are are really whacky and unclear... maybe try again next year ...

 

[EdgeHunter]

Quote from Lights:

Whatever man, he lives to torture Don Bright and nitpick at a firm he wish he managed. And when something's reciprocated back to him, he obfuscates stupidity. Just an observation.

Okay, now that was dead bang clear... thanks...

 

[Lights]

The problem lies in the fact that these markets don't trade off supply/demand but in a correlational matrix superlevered into monstrous macro hedges and cross derivatives. If nobody's learned anything from the CDS MBS and CDO markets, this discussion is pointless.

Liquidity is eventually inversely correlated to the magnitude of leveraging in the open interest. This is what can happen to a gazillion dollar levered market at mid teen VIX. calm before storm, complacency prior to destruction, etc.

Some big whale pulled the plug that day after he sniffed out open positions he didn't wanna have to serve.


They're not really black swans. They're just events that most people are blind to or rather too dumb to see beforehand. The false assumption is that there will always be liquidity. Programs do a good job in proving that is false, real fast.

Quote from propseeker:

let me ask you a question lights. please answer specifically.

1) exactly how should market makers (hft's whatever you want to call them) have handled may 6th with market orders coming down the pipe on ALL their stocks sweeping the book down 10-90%+ in seconds?

2) do you know what an ISO is? this was the primary tool used on the 6th, and they resulted in FILLS, not pulls.

you asked me if i did the research... i actually have. i had to research it, because i traded it and it was a fantastic example of an intraday black swan.

market makers got STUFFED that day. across the board in EVERYTHING. i trade full-auto prop, making markets, and i can say that I got completely STUFFED that day, capital completely maxed out (too early btw), and sat through a period of complete chaos until those sellers let up.

it wasn't about pulling bids, it was about sellers DESTROYING bids, DESTROYING bid books all the way down in a blink. over and over. in minutes and seconds. EVERYTHING. you couldn't even hedge. the fckin spoo pit was 10 handles spread! 10 HANDLES! why?! because they'd swept that too!

if you were making markets that day, you would KNOW. it wasn't as one-sided as you make out to be.

 

[CQNC]

Quote from Maverick74:

Lights, you keep talking but you never say anything. There is an old saying, you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts. You are bringing nothing to the table. You keep screaming and yet no one on this thread knows wtf you are screaming about. Your argument keeps shifting without ever actually saying what it is you are arguing about. Honestly there has not been one post of substance from you on this thread. Not one material piece of information. Hell no one on here even knows what you are upset about as a prop trader.

Second that. I still don't know WTF he's talking about here, or what point he's trying to make. My guess is, he got his ass reemed on May 6, or during the 2008 crash, and he's blaming GS, his own broker, or someone that he perceives as an enemy of the state.

Or, the most likely suggestion is, he's just playing devil's advocate, trolling for the fun of pissing everyone off. He does seem to have your attention, which Mav, I'd be ignoring him at this point for having nothing really to say except to read himself screaming.

 

[Lights]

yawn, commission rates and payout %'s are more fun to talk bout.

Quote from CQNC:

Second that. I still don't know WTF he's talking about here, or what point he's trying to make. My guess is, he got his ass reemed on May 6, or during the 2008 crash, and he's blaming GS, his own broker, or someone that he perceives as an enemy of the state.

Or, the most likely suggestion is, he's just playing devil's advocate, trolling for the fun of pissing everyone off. He does seem to have your attention, which Mav, I'd be ignoring him at this point for having nothing really to say except to read himself screaming.

 

[CQNC]

Quote from EdgeHunter:

Okay, now that was dead bang clear... thanks...

obfuscate [ˈɒbfʌsˌkeɪt]
vb (tr)
1. to obscure or darken
2. to perplex or bewilder

I am not sure how one makes stupidity any less dark, more perplexing, or bewildered than Lights has been today.

WAIT, I see it now. It's like irony.

dark>obfuscate>stupid>dumb>dumber

obfuscate
verb
definition:
confuse
synonyms:
baffle, becloud, befuddle, bewilder, cloud, complicate, conceal, confound, darken, fog, fuddle, muddle, obscure, perplex, puzzle, rattle

light
adjective
definition:
illuminated
synonyms:
ablaze, aglow, bright, brilliant, burnished, clear, cloudless, flashing, fluorescent, glossy, glowing, lambent, lucent, luminous, lustrous, phosphorescent, polished, radiant, refulgent, resplendent, rich, scintillant, shining, shiny, sunny, unclouded, unobscured, vivid, well-lighted, well-lit

It's like, Lights sees all and we're don't. Like God, only he speaks through an alias on elitetrader.com.

Cool.

Hey God, er, Lights, why do bad things happen to good people?

And can you tell me where my dog hid my car keys?

 

[Lights]

Obfuscating stupidity is where appearing a little dumb can be the deceiver's best friend. Do I need to spell out everything for you? Aren't you all traders where the job is to seek out hidden gem under the belly of deceit?

Quote from CQNC:

obfuscate [ˈɒbfʌsˌkeɪt]
vb (tr)
1. to obscure or darken
2. to perplex or bewilder

I am not sure how one makes stupidity any less dark, more perplexing, or bewildered than Lights has been today.

WAIT, I see it now. It's like irony.

dark>obfuscate>stupid>dumb>dumber

obfuscate
verb
definition:
confuse
synonyms:
baffle, becloud, befuddle, bewilder, cloud, complicate, conceal, confound, darken, fog, fuddle, muddle, obscure, perplex, puzzle, rattle

light
adjective
definition:
illuminated
synonyms:
ablaze, aglow, bright, brilliant, burnished, clear, cloudless, flashing, fluorescent, glossy, glowing, lambent, lucent, luminous, lustrous, phosphorescent, polished, radiant, refulgent, resplendent, rich, scintillant, shining, shiny, sunny, unclouded, unobscured, vivid, well-lighted, well-lit

It's like, Lights sees all and we're don't. Like God, only he speaks through an alias on elitetrader.com.

Cool.

Hey God, er, Lights, why do bad things happen to good people?

And can you tell me where my dog hid my car keys?

 

[CQNC]

Quote from Lights:

Obfuscating stupidity is where appearing a little dumb can be the deceiver's best friend. Do I need to spell out everything for you? Aren't you all traders where the job is to seek out hidden gem under the belly of deceit?

par·a·noi·a   
[par-uh-noi-uh]
–noun
1. Psychiatry . a mental disorder characterized by systematized delusions and the projection of personal conflicts, which are ascribed to the supposed hostility of others, sometimes progressing to disturbances of consciousness and aggressive acts believed to be performed in self-defense or as a mission.
2. baseless or excessive suspicion of the motives of others.