BREAKING NEWS: Dollar loses reserve status to yen & euro

Quote from achilles28:

Underconsumption because Americans took on too much debt. Now, they must pay it back (interest + principle). This equates to reduced disposable income. What happens when you borrow money just for consumption? You spend more than you earn. What happens when you pay it back? You must spend less than you earn (pay back interest + principle). The debt repayment cycle goes a long way to explaining economic expansion and contraction. And by proxy, market bulls and busts. We overconsume during periods of increased debt creation (bull market). Then underconsume during periods of debt repayment (bear market). Which is why the market oscillates to such extremes...

Bubbles destroy wealth by creating debt at valuations the economy can't support. Home prices or equities, doesn't matter. If DOW goes to 20K, it'll look like the Chinese stock market, where half of all loans made by banks chase better returns in the market. Like the crash of 1929, when the market collapses (and it always does), "investors" will be on the hook for hundreds of billions in principle collateralized by stock valuations worth 50-80% less than the principle originally invested. Hopefully, not leveraged. So now, if we get an equity bubble (then crash), investors will have MORE DEBT to pay down from market returns that collapsed. In terms of real equity.

The markets being a zero sum game doesn't mean bubbles are good for the economy. Bubbles screw the middle class/average consumer, while enriching investment banks and speculators that can see the hammer before it drops. Economies like Mexico where wealth is concentrated in the hands of the few, create material prosperity for none. A broad-based middle class is key to strong consumption and a strong economy. Bubbles wipe out and destroy middle class wealth, thereby weakening the economy. Which is exactly what happened with housing and explains present economic conditions in America.

Exporters will float their currency once American consumers get so heavily indebted, they can no longer consume at prior levels. This is happening already. Another bubble could seal our fate on demand side. Supply side, 0% interest rates and massive quantitative easing spell big inflation in the medium term for America (and any Country dumb enough to peg their currency to ours). IF we get another bubble, the American consumer will have to contend with a dual assault - high personal debt and massive inflation. Disposable incomes will decline precipitously. Foreigners will have to make a decision to import American inflation (and destabilize their economies at the outrage of voters) for far less return, or depeg, let their currencies free float, and accept a New Normal. Its all relative. Asian countries enjoy a high personal savings rate. They haven't learned to mortgage their futures via consumer credit, like we have in the West (a hallmark of Western Capitalism). Japan, China, Taiwan and Singapore could realistically introduce consumer credit to offset collapsing overseas demand, if they chose to depeg. Very real possibility as China (and Japan) are not as dumb as we think (or need).


excellent post achilles

but none of that will happen to the US because there is more to it. the military presence and hegemony abroad which is part of the WWII after math and continuing decline of the former soviet union is another important aspect of the equation.

since the US has the power to overtake any unfriendly regime and effectively influences the geopolitical agenda, including securing important raw materials sources abroad or exporting their franchise elsewhere in the world, this results in a important revenue stream for the US treasury in the form of taxes as the corporate america cashes on, which balances out the excesses of consumption or public expenditure. a cold analysis of the US finances reveals nothing but what other western economies have experienced as of late.

going forward, the asian countries will more and more induce consumption rather than trying to unpeg their currencies to the USD. the reason being, if they do that, they'd lose 1 third of their economic output (due to the vanished demand) while their nations would starve to death due to the isolation. remember more than 2/3 of the GDP comes from western countries, thus the highly indebted consumption model that the western world has put in pace is going to be exported to the asian countries, while the US will continue to print money to pay off their debts (as any other western country), courtesy of the emerging markets and the current geopolitical scenario.
 
Quote from achilles28:

It seems you don't understand supply-side economics or the impact of deficit spending (debt) on GDP (or currency value).

When everyone debases equally, commodities (and inflation), sky-rocket. Floating huge deficits makes it impossible to raise rates - and therefore, ensures future inflation via monetization - down the road. Both of those facts mean the USD is toast. And any Country that ties itself to it.

check the us public accounts and compare it with the rest of the western world and will see no difference.

the asians are financing it because of their savings rate. the americans (individually) are more prone to bankruptcy than the asians but the US, as a country, is far better than the others because is an economic super power and the most important trade partner of the asians, which would NOT survive without the US playing its role. that's why the USD is not at risk in the near future (next 20 years).
 
Quote from cleveland45:

US is a debtor nation (it was not in the 1980's).
More money printed equals more and more debt that we are not paying back as revenues fall further and further behind.
Add increasing interest rates on top of the ever increasing debt and what do you think is going to happen eventually?
Nothing?


money is created out of thin air. it is completely effortless task. as long as the US maintains its economic supremacy the USD is untouchable.

since it will take at least 20 years to china overtake the US, there is still plenty of time to see how this matter unfolds. now, saying that the US (or the USD for that matter) is about to collapse is a ridiculous and naive assertion.
 
Quote from crash n burn:

excellent post achilles

but none of that will happen to the US because there is more to it. the military presence and hegemony abroad which is part of the WWII after math and continuing decline of the former soviet union is another important aspect of the equation.

since the US has the power to overtake any unfriendly regime and effectively influences the geopolitical agenda, including securing important raw materials sources abroad or exporting their franchise elsewhere in the world, this results in a important revenue stream for the US treasury in the form of taxes as the corporate america cashes on, which balances out the excesses of consumption or public expenditure. a cold analysis of the US finances reveals nothing but what other western economies have experienced as of late.

going forward, the asian countries will more and more induce consumption rather than trying to unpeg their currencies to the USD. the reason being, if they do that, they'd lose 1 third of their economic output (due to the vanished demand) while their nations would starve to death due to the isolation. remember more than 2/3 of the GDP comes from western countries, thus the highly indebted consumption model that the western world has put in pace is going to be exported to the asian countries, while the US will continue to print money to pay off their debts (as any other western country), courtesy of the emerging markets and the current geopolitical scenario.

And what happens when the aforementioned raw materials are no longer quoted in USD?

Also, how can anybody arrive at the conclusion that it is the USA dictating global manoeuvres when it is the Chinese who have pegged their currency at a rate which favours THEM and not the USA? If you believe the USA have the military capacity to "overtake" China then I'm afraid to say, your living in cloud cuckoo land.

I'm not the type of person to attack any sovereign nation as it just isn't my style. However I cannot help but to ponder upon why some citizens of the USA continue to believe that your country can "overtake" "unfriendly" nations at will?

The USA lost the Vietnam war, and hasn't managed to control a group of rocket launching cave dwellers who don't even have a sturdy pair of boots to wear, for the best part of 10 years.

Recent news reports circulating within the public domain (I believe there was a thread on ET the other day regarding this issue) suggest that an increasing number of soldiers are losing the will to fight for a cause they don't understand, hardly a glowing indictment for the continuity of a revenue stream funded by way of "securing terrorist regimes", and that isn't even taking into consideration that the revenue derived from raw materials may not infact cover medium term expenses, even if it continues to be quoted in USD.
 
Quote from pitz:

When do the bankers get liquidated (as in, I mean, personally liquidated)?

Population in the USA must be getting pretty restless now. All that anger is going to be directed
I am with you up to this point... When the banksters get legally prosecuted and are frog marched to jail in orange jump suits... then we can only start to turn this economy around...

until then.. nope... not a chance.. business as usual...
 
Quote from ByLoSellHi:

They said the same shit in the 70s and 80s.

It will take someone like Volcker to come along, but political pressure will force it, ultimately.
ByLo'

Et Tu... The Dollar is gonna stay the reserve currency... ?

I am right behind you on every one of your other posts that show we are headed to hell economically and now you are saying that.. "No Problem.. when things really get dire... the dollar will just shoot up and get strong again..."

Yes, the same thing happened in the early decades with extreme dollar weakness... but... but... but...

This time the USA DOES NOT HAVE SUFFICIENT GDP growth to cover our long term debts and we have run out of borrowing power...

Karl Denniniger shows this very clearly in his math layouts of GDP to DEBT growth... posts on his blog...

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/1263-Bernanke-Dissembles;-The-Economy-Burns.html

Read the whole freaking blog and anybody get back to here and post that the math he puts up is wrong...

ByLo'... I know you agree the economy is going to hell but somehow the Dollar is going to recover... color me way confused...

and something is gonna give in the next few months and its NOT going to be in the USA's favor...

The Empire Is Ova...
 
Quote from crash n burn:

money is created out of thin air. it is completely effortless task. as long as the US maintains its economic supremacy the USD is untouchable.

since it will take at least 20 years to china overtake the US, there is still plenty of time to see how this matter unfolds. now, saying that the US (or the USD for that matter) is about to collapse is a ridiculous and naive assertion.


Clearly the US is on the defensive and will remain so until it takes action to shore up it's currency. I am not even sure it is possible any longer, given the complete disregard for the massive monetary and fiscal problems we face.
 
Quote from EdgeHunter:

ByLo'

Et Tu... The Dollar is gonna stay the reserve currency... ?

I am right behind you on every one of your other posts that show we are headed to hell economically and now you are saying that.. "No Problem.. when things really get dire... the dollar will just shoot up and get strong again..."

Yes, the same thing happened in the early decades with extreme dollar weakness... but... but... but...

This time the USA DOES NOT HAVE SUFFICIENT GDP growth to cover our long term debts and we have run out of borrowing power...

Karl Denniniger shows this very clearly in his math layouts of GDP to DEBT growth... posts on his blog...

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/1263-Bernanke-Dissembles;-The-Economy-Burns.html

Read the whole freaking blog and anybody get back to here and post that the math he puts up is wrong...

ByLo'... I know you agree the economy is going to hell but somehow the Dollar is going to recover... color me way confused...

and something is gonna give in the next few months and its NOT going to be in the USA's favor...

The Empire Is Ova...



Lol, Volcker used massive deficit spending, of which not a cent was ever paid for, to create the boom times of the early 80's under Reagan. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
 
You boys and girls do not seem to have much faith in your beloved leaders.
All they are trying to do is get you all to borrow your way out of debt.

sosueme
 
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