Bordom and over-trading

Quote from Reitberg:

Yeah, those times are eastern.

And I think that you reduce your stress greatly if you do not spend a lot of time in front of the charting screens.

This is my opinion on day trading:

I think that trading can be a sickness, and I have the balls, some would say the audacity, to say that you shouldn't spend that much time trading if you want to play this game for the long haul.

I do not think that working long hours trading is to one's benefit. I've had so many traders tell me that I should work more during the trading day; I have tried their game and lost money. Furthermore, I believe that there is nothing wrong with hitting singles and doubles everyday if you can pull it off consistently. Not only do I pay off my rent in 1-2 days, but I can do whatever I want wth all of my free time. And the best part of it all is that I feel good about myself most of the time because I'm makin' money most of the time. I don't know if I'll ever be able to trade without emotions and sit there all day firing off scalps. Maybe someday, but for now I going to stick to what works.
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This is a good approach, and one I am doing as well. The markets have gotten to the point where the days of trading all day long greatly reduce consistent profits

The best and most predictable moves (in stocks) often occur from 9:30 to about 11:00..after that it's rangebound and/or random.

After 4 hours of chop, who's awake enough to get anything from 3:00-4:00. By then you are dulled to death!

An the other thing is that, it's very hard to climb out of a hole in these markets..there just are not enough opportunites anymore,
and trying too hard is a recipe for pain.

Hell, two years ago I remember being down $2-3K in the AM, and was unfazed by it, cause I knew I could get it back...some days you'd go home +3-4K; now I get nervous if I am down 500-1000, and will usually stop.

Sometimes less is more, especially now.

PS. Check out MMM today..gave you 2 nice points in an hour, then just drifted around.
 
I'm so glad that I've found people who agree with me on this topic, especially because of the "real traders" that have given me a bunch of crap for not trading all day long.

Good luck to you all.
 
Quote from Reitberg:

I'm so glad that I've found people who agree with me on this topic, especially because of the "real traders" that have given me a bunch of crap for not trading all day long.

Good luck to you all.
More...

I got warped early. A couple of years ago, I got involved in Teresa Lo's trading room, at the time called Done in 90 Minutes. She did nothing but futures. She got out of bed about fifteen minutes before they opened, woke herself up with coffee while reviewing what economic reports were due, if any, reviewed the charts, traded until 1100 or 1130, then quit for breakfast (she lived and lives in Vancouver). And that was that. No research. No scans. No chart review other than the major indices and the futures. And that's been my bias ever since.

A guru who frequents these boards has said often that a "real" trader is in front of his monitor all day long, that that's part of the job. But when you read his logs, he seems to spend far more time away from his computer than in front of it, coming up with almost any excuse to avoid trading more than the minimum.

Part of this stems from what you consider to be "enough". Many traders seem to want everything there is. But there are also many traders who just want to make a good living working at home part-time. If they can make ten points in an hour, they're perfectly content to turn off the computer and go do something else, and they couldn't care less what the market did for the rest of the day. Those who want everything can't understand that and think it's rookie behavior, but that's pretty much their problem.

--Db
 
Db and Reitberg very, very true.

Wanting everything there is usually leads to disaster.

The way I see it is if you can master a few setups and
not be bothered that a move took place without you,
success will happen.

The more you try and try beyond a certain point ,you then end up forcing the issue and breaking your rules.

I think I'll print this post and tape it to my monitor so
next time I have the desire to do something stupid..........
 
Monee, Monee, Monee. So True, So True, So True!!!!!!

You hit the nail on the head in your post. Master a few setups and that's basically all that you need.

I'll tell you guys what I'm about. I'm 22 years old. After one months worth of trading minis, I figured out this way of trading.

The first month that I implemented my system, I made over $1G/day, averaging about $1200-$1300. It got to the point where I was makin' $1500/day. I was profitable 18/19 days!!!!
It was incredible.

Then I tried to master better intraday swing trading techniques, and it didn't work out too well. Needless to say, I lost a ton of money.

Now I'm done with my experiments and back on the consistent $1G/day plan, and I have so much free time in my day, and I can so whatever I want with it. It is great!!! I love this job and I hope I never lose the discipline that I need to do my job correctly.

I've found this thread soooo psychologically helpful. I'm glad that I have found you people!!!. I too will print this thread and paste in on my wall.
 
It really does not matter how long you trade, but whether you make money month in month out. I do not take more than 3 trades a day, not even every day, so I cannot say I work as hard as those who trade all the day, but sometimes I have to watch the screen all the day even if not very closely.

Most people who overtrade usually do not have a well designed plan and/or are not very disciplined. You can trade all day long and still be fresh at the end of it if you carefully choose your trades. Patience is the most important thing in trading. Without it you will burn out very fast.
 
You are right about burning out. That's what is comes down to.

If I've made money and I'm really shaken up...I'll walk away from my computer and wait a while b4 I get back to look for the next high probability set up.
 
Quote from Reitberg:

Monee, Monee, Monee. So True, So True, So True!!!!!!

You hit the nail on the head in your post. Master a few setups and that's basically all that you need.

I'll tell you guys what I'm about. I'm 22 years old. After one months worth of trading minis, I figured out this way of trading.

The first month that I implemented my system, I made over $1G/day, averaging about $1200-$1300. It got to the point where I was makin' $1500/day. I was profitable 18/19 days!!!!
It was incredible.

Then I tried to master better intraday swing trading techniques, and it didn't work out too well. Needless to say, I lost a ton of money.

Now I'm done with my experiments and back on the consistent $1G/day plan, and I have so much free time in my day, and I can so whatever I want with it. It is great!!! I love this job and I hope I never lose the discipline that I need to do my job correctly.

I've found this thread soooo psychologically helpful. I'm glad that I have found you people!!!. I too will print this thread and paste in on my wall.
More...



this (excerpt of an) article comes up with some interesting points according to what has been posted here. it is taken from linda b. raschkes old website :

"
The S&P market is a trading arena unto itself, which can accommodate many different trading styles. Not only does this market display a different daily profile than the other futures markets, but it has a much longer "length of line" (intraday swings), which offers more trading opportunities. Additionally, there is a wealth of information provided by many internal indicators on the equities market that some professionals like to monitor. In this article, I would like to share some observations, pointers, and favorite trading patterns. However, let me also say that the majority of the professional S&P daytraders I know tend to specialize in just one pattern or trade just one style. This is definitely a market where overtrading can be a temptation.

[...]

On average there are only 2-3 great S&P intraday "legs" or swings. Most professionals catch only 3-4 really great trades a week, if that! (Most trades will often be very small wins and losses). So don't be too harsh on yourself if you feel that you are missing the majority of the movement. Overtrading suckers one into seeing only the trees and missing the forest.

[...]

I suggest keeping a daily journal to note your own observations. Also note which types of trades seem to work out best for you. I know one market professional who trades best by waiting for a strong afternoon thrust. He then enters on the first pullback in the direction of the thrust. He claims he loses on balance getting "chopped up" in the morning's cross-currents. However, another good friend can trade only in the morning and only from the short side. He waits for an initial morning surge, places his shorts, and never risks more than 2 points. This professional has consistently made a most enviable living for the past 15 years. The moral of the story is: he knows himself and what style works best for him, and he always has a resting stop loss order in the marketplace.
"


hope this helps ...
 
doing well from the get-go can often be the kiss of death; very well is even worse! So the number one thing to master and make a habit... particularly when you succeed quickly is humility in the face of such success. Not preaching here... but "paying forward" some valuable insight I gained at high costs.

b.t.w "that" is a 'trait' one (I/we) must constantly renew, like a vow.... day in and day out. Confidence yes, pretentiousness.. no!
 
You (Reitberg) said:

"I think that trading can be a sickness, and I have the balls, some would say the audacity, to say that you shouldn't spend that much time trading if you want to play this game for the long haul.
I do not think that working long hours trading is to one's benefit. I've had so many traders tell me that I should work more during the trading day; I have tried their game and lost money. Furthermore, I believe that there is nothing wrong with hitting singles and doubles everyday if you can pull it off consistently. Not only do I pay off my rent in 1-2 days, but I can do whatever I want wth all of my free time. And the best part of it all is that I feel good about myself most of the time because I'm makin' money most of the time. I don't know if I'll ever be able to trade without emotions and sit there all day firing off scalps. Maybe someday, but for now I going to stick to what works."


Great post... you make some key points! Now, since it's not broken don't fix it simply 'cause someone else influences U, bro!
 
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