Blacklisted by Brokers

T

thomsonfx

Dear all fellows,

Could anybody tell if you have the experience to be blacklisted by any broker simply because you are consistently profitable (either discretionary or through system trading) ?

What are the actions for the blacklisted candidates ? Do not accept any orders from them ? Suspend the account ?

If so, can you disclose which are they ?

Since the number of brokers which expose the API for order execution are so limited, anybody experienced that it keeps being blacklisted until you can longer use an automated solution ?

For the brokers which act against certain traders individually. Can they make the "spikes", that is, make an extra-ordinary quote which force close the individually client's positions.. but that spike only appear on that client's chart. Is that possible ?

Seems all brokers dont offset all clients' trades through the market ? Any exception ?

Thanks so much !!
 
I don't know about brokers, but you can easily get blacklisted from spreadbetting firms if you have any sort of consistent success.

Quote from thomsonfx:

Dear all fellows,

Could anybody tell if you have the experience to be blacklisted by any broker simply because you are consistently profitable (either discretionary or through system trading) ?

What are the actions for the blacklisted candidates ? Do not accept any orders from them ? Suspend the account ?

If so, can you disclose which are they ?

Since the number of brokers which expose the API for order execution are so limited, anybody experienced that it keeps being blacklisted until you can longer use an automated solution ?

For the brokers which act against certain traders individually. Can they make the "spikes", that is, make an extra-ordinary quote which force close the individually client's positions.. but that spike only appear on that client's chart. Is that possible ?

Seems all brokers dont offset all clients' trades through the market ? Any exception ?

Thanks so much !!
More...
 
Quote from verynewboy:

I don't know about brokers, but you can easily get blacklisted from spreadbetting firms if you have any sort of consistent success.
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What are those "spreadbetting" firms ? Any large institutions like Interactive Brokers, Tradestation, Oanda, Man Financial, Gain Capital, FXCM, CMC..will blacklist client simply because they can make profit consistently ?

In this sense, there is no difference of playing from broker with playing with casinos ? In casino, you will also be blacklisted if you can win consistently through black jack by card counting technique (that technique is proven quantitively like backtesting by historical data in trading context). Once blacklisted, you need to find another casino to continue your life. You then end up with nobody accept your entrance.
 
Quote from thomsonfx:

What are those "spreadbetting" firms ? Any large institutions like Interactive Brokers, Tradestation, Oanda, Man Financial, Gain Capital, FXCM, CMC..will blacklist client simply because they can make profit consistently ?

In this sense, there is no difference of playing from broker with playing with casinos ? In casino, you will also be blacklisted if you can win consistently through black jack by card counting technique (that technique is proven quantitively like backtesting by historical data in trading context). Once blacklisted, you need to find another casino to continue your life. You then end up with nobody accept your entrance.
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You don't appear to realize that some of the parties you quoted are brokers and some are bucket shops (casinos). For example:

Interactive brokers and Man are brokers and won't blacklist you because they don't trade against you, they simply take a commission on every trade so they don't care if you win or lose (except they'd like you to be around for a while).

FXCM CMC and Oanda are bucket shops and might well blacklist you as your success can be their failure.
 
How to distinguish a bucketshop from a broker ? By experience or by insider news or other method ? I have just checked InterbankFX where I would like to implement my automated system on and it states "We do not hold our customers trades or trade against our customers" I suspect that all brokers claim the same but whether really do it behind is a question. Do anybody know the cases for Gain Capital, Tradestation, Genesis Securities, InterbankFX, MB Trading, CyberTrader, or any other sizable brokerage firms ?

The reputation for the brokers that blacklist clients simply becoz they are consistently profitable will drop quickly right ? I expect that sth like "XXX always blacklist the winners, Good luck to all of you", "Close your biz and go back home, XXX" appear frequently in the forums but when I search through the forums I cant see any related search result ? Nothing is done from those being blacklisted ?
 
Quote from kiwi_trader:

You don't appear to realize that some of the parties you quoted are brokers and some are bucket shops (casinos). For example:

Interactive brokers and Man are brokers and won't blacklist you because they don't trade against you, they simply take a commission on every trade so they don't care if you win or lose (except they'd like you to be around for a while).

FXCM CMC and Oanda are bucket shops and might well blacklist you as your success can be their failure.
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Kiwi you really believe CMC and Oanda are no better the FXCM? Wow, I don't trade Forex, but folks I know that do say good things about CMC and Oanda, not FXCM though.
 
Dear all fellows,

I had decided to devote my coming times to go automated but it really shocks me after hearing from some of you.

Below I would to verify sth...

Are the following potential behaviour will be blacklisted by brokers/liquidation bank and/or bucketshop (provided that it shows from your trade record that win consistently) ?

1. The so called scalping technique. Simply buying on the ask and selling on the bid. Question: arent the broker is receiving the spread as income ?

2. Arbitrage opportunity like the triangular arbitrage from cross currencies. Question: Again, what's wrong with it ?

3. Trade on data release. Question: That's why FXCM ban all traders from trading on data release times ? The bucketshop or the bank provide for liquidation must lose on average right.

4. Trade on news header (this is what I heard from a private message).

5. Automated trading on short timeframe like algorithm applying on minutes-based timeframe. Question: If really so, it's really ridiculous.. Then no successful day traders can survive from the broker's platform right ? Should those winners turn themselves to earn in a longer timeframe and hide under the radar ?

I heard that the broker will manually act against your account before blacklisting you. One mean is by slippage. In my understanding, slippage means the quote offered to you is significantly different from those offered in the market. Have anybody tried to log down the price which trigger the buy/sell signal from your trade and also the price for the corresponding trades logged in the broker's side? How serious is the slippage ? Another mean is by requote. For every trade you make, if it is not in favor for the broker, they say that your order is cancelled and give another quote to you for acceptance until your trade end up with a wrong bid, at least in the short term.

In the last attempt, if the bucketshop cant find any trick to play against you. They will try to risk your deposit ?!

From a quote in another web site:
"Good luck on trying to find the scalpers. Do you know what will happen if casinos catch you card reading? They throw you out. The difference here is a card reader actually can make some seriously cash before being caught. The life span of a forex scalper tend to be very shortly lived. I believe all forex dealers have some kind of program that screens for scalpers. They can catch you after couple trades. Once they find you, you will be put on the blacklist permanently. If they are nice, they will let you withdrawal and forever ban you. If they are not nice, they will take some serious actions. "

What "action" can the broker do to you if you are being caught by scalping ? Have anybody heard that somebody's deposit cannot be withdrawn becoz of scalping ? Please advise ! Thank you very much !!!
 
Why don't you try trading a legitimate market instead of one in which you cant tell the difference between a bucket shop and a broker?

For instance, trade the currency futures traded on Globex.

OldTrader
 
If they don't charge a commission, then they trade against you. If they do charge a commish, then they may be a straight forward broker, simply processing your trades with a number of different banks.


Quote from thomsonfx:

How to distinguish a bucketshop from a broker ? By experience or by insider news or other method ? I have just checked InterbankFX where I would like to implement my automated system on and it states "We do not hold our customers trades or trade against our customers" I suspect that all brokers claim the same but whether really do it behind is a question. Do anybody know the cases for Gain Capital, Tradestation, Genesis Securities, InterbankFX, MB Trading, CyberTrader, or any other sizable brokerage firms ?
More...
 
Quote from Jayford:

If they don't charge a commission, then they trade against you.
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Can somebody explain how they do this? They trade against us? And is a bucket shop the same as a prop shop, where we trade the firms money?
 
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