Black Box

Nitro,

So true, and personally speaking, I found out the hard way....I have wasted so much time. Not that I am an authority on trading and investing. I just know what works for me....CTA status is nothing for me....I guess its back to trading my own account....but not full time. I do not feel qualified to teach yet...but I derive pleasure from it....I like seeing people develop....

I am not the best trader in the world....and there is a lot of room for me to develop my own skills too....but I feel automation is the future and would like to spend more time there....

Michael B.

P.S. I sometimes think I would like to be in a room full of traders and be where the action is....

Quote from nitro:

ES,

People that want to invest money, AFAIK, always want to do it in such a way so that there is no discretion involved. The reason is they want repeatability...I don't blame them.

Getting into that game brings a whole another set of skills. I have friends that went that route after being programmers at a hedge fund. They both told me the same thing. If you are not good at handholding "Investors," don't get into this business.

I have come to the conclusion that if you have a good system, you should trade it for your own account. The other possibility is to hand it over to someone that can throw a large amount of money at it, but that has it's downside too.

The simplicity of it all is always striking, isn't it?


nitro
More...
 
I too have a solid trading system and would love to have it programed. I am wondering what program to use? and what site I should use to learn and program my trading system?

Any help would be great.
 
Quote from c_verm:

I too have a solid trading system and would love to have it programed. I am wondering what program to use? and what site I should use to learn and program my trading system?

Any help would be great.
More...
I would use WLD if I were doing work for someone else. For my own work, I use C# and my own platform.

http://www.wealth-lab.com

nitro
 
I have already programmed a system (preliminary - primary, but not yet secondary trading rule has been coded), and am wondering what to do with it.

It's profitable after commissions, market neutral.

I have been working towards starting a hedge fund, but think it will be very hard to raise funds without the dangerous disclosure to many...
 
Well its time for me to post my results on black box firms:

I ended up taking my trading idea to a firm called
Black Box LLC located in Chicago. This firm basically
takes your idea programs it, puts up the money to
trade it and actually trades it. They have a decent
split which depends on the risk of the actual trade.
Keep in mind I did not put up any money, the only risk
I took was to reveal my idea(which is probably the biggest risk).

The catch is they don't take any idea it has to be
good, if you have proof the strategy is profitable
that helps.

They will actually fly you into Chicago if they are
interested. I was a bit nervous to give the idea at
first, but I have a handful of good ideas and I just
gave them one. Of course I signed a non disclosure
with them. They also have some kind of intellectual
property insurance you can get, but I decided against this.

Anyway from what I can tell they have been honest and up
front with everything they've done. I even waited to
get a check from them and made sure it cleared before
I posted anything here.

I also met with a firm called Last Atlantis and they
seem good although I have no first hand experience. I
just happened to sign the deal with Black Box LLC
first.

hope this helps,

Scalp100
 
Quote from scalp100:

Well its time for me to post my results on black box firms:

I ended up taking my trading idea to a firm called
Black Box LLC located in Chicago. This firm basically
takes your idea programs it, puts up the money to
trade it and actually trades it. They have a decent
split which depends on the risk of the actual trade.
Keep in mind I did not put up any money, the only risk
I took was to reveal my idea(which is probably the biggest risk).

The catch is they don't take any idea it has to be
good, if you have proof the strategy is profitable
that helps.

They will actually fly you into Chicago if they are
interested. I was a bit nervous to give the idea at
first, but I have a handful of good ideas and I just
gave them one. Of course I signed a non disclosure
with them. They also have some kind of intellectual
property insurance you can get, but I decided against this.

Anyway from what I can tell they have been honest and up
front with everything they've done. I even waited to
get a check from them and made sure it cleared before
I posted anything here.

I also met with a firm called Last Atlantis and they
seem good although I have no first hand experience. I
just happened to sign the deal with Black Box LLC
first.

hope this helps,

Scalp100
More...
:D
nononsense
 
Never ask a programming service to do the stuff even with a non-disclosure agreement. I have hired an engineer for 7 years and during 4 years I put it on the core programming of our system, half time he worked for clients project - some in financial field - the other half time on our core project that's how he was financed. Although he was very good at programming and maths he had a poor understanding of the underlying concept so that I didn't have to worry that he will ever be able to disclose anything valuable :D.

If you can't hire someone because the financial is too heavy learn programming yourself it's not difficult. In fact I could program the stuff myself but I was too busy to do it as I was myself consulting for clients. Nevertheless I'm not as speed at programming than a specialised programmer because I'm rather architect or project manager as usual profession so that it was better also to hire someone.

Quote from scalp100:

hey 'one' thanks for the post, 20% is a decent cut from what my research shows so far. I feel the same way about trading ideas. No matter how great a trading idea is, it will not make money unless it's implemented and constantly maintained. I have several trading strategies I use and I think finding a firm to maximize the potential of one trading idea for a cut of profits is a good risk/reward.

I have learned a bunch since I originally started this thread. After I've done more homework and come to some conclusions about the different black box firms I will post my experiences.

One last note; I'm not trying to market a trading 'system' to the public. Also, I'm not trying to buy a trading idea from anyone.

I have a proven trading edge which I would like a black box firm to program and trade for me. Thanks for all the posts!

Scalp
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Quote from harrytrader:

[...]

If you can't hire someone because the financial is too heavy learn programming yourself it's not difficult. In fact I could program the stuff myself but I was too busy to do it as I was myself consulting for clients. Nevertheless I'm not as speed at programming than a specialised programmer because I'm rather architect or project manager as usual profession so that it was better also to hire someone.
More...
:confused:
nononsense
 
If one is completely ignorant about programming but wants to spend time to code his own system, what would you recommend? WealthLab or Tradestation? How long does it take to learn? A rough estimate will do. And for those of you who have coded their own systems, do you go all the way to autotrading?

Quote from harrytrader:

Never ask a programming service to do the stuff even with a non-disclosure agreement. I have hired an engineer for 7 years and during 4 years I put it on the core programming of our system, half time he worked for clients project - some in financial field - the other half time on our core project that's how he was financed. Although he was very good at programming and maths he had a poor understanding of the underlying concept so that I didn't have to worry that he will ever be able to disclose anything valuable :D.

If you can't hire someone because the financial is too heavy learn programming yourself it's not difficult. In fact I could program the stuff myself but I was too busy to do it as I was myself consulting for clients. Nevertheless I'm not as speed at programming than a specialised programmer because I'm rather architect or project manager as usual profession so that it was better also to hire someone.
More...
 
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