Bitcoin Plummeting 11% to $37,980

I am pro BTC, anti fraud and manipulation of it. Pretty frustrating to watch bad actors who have overtaken the scene and derail from great goals of the project. Everyone should be voicing against the Tether fraud for us to have a chance at ETF. But they don't because of greed and fear of what the real markets will look like without the fraudulent stablecoins. And the exchanges which are working against people.

In a similar manner I also don't condone what the shitfluencers use to bring in new players who don't understand the markets and bound to lose money following their jingoism.
 
tifoji said:
I am pro BTC, anti fraud and manipulation of it. Pretty frustrating to watch bad actors who have overtaken the scene and derail from great goals of the project. Everyone should be voicing against the Tether fraud for us to have a chance at ETF. But they don't because of greed and fear of what the real markets will look like without the fraudulent stablecoins. And the exchanges which are working against people.

In a similar manner I also don't condone what the shitfluencers use to bring in new players who don't understand the markets and bound to lose money following their jingoism.
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Do you really think the tether issue is what is stopping an spot settled ETF from being approved?
 
tifoji said:
Funny, I also joined Bitcointalk in 2013 and still post there.

1 BTC = 1 BTC happens only during crashes. Otherwise you will see toxic bitcoin salesman touting how much it is worth in USD (which is also a fraud metric) and it ranges from Saylor, Winklevoss thugs and all the prominent social media influencers.

The correct valuation of 1 BTC is the amount of Tethers needed to purchase it, since all the decentralization aspect is gone as the miners are being kicked around the world. You can't meaningfully mine it at home since about 2012 (But this was predicted and known by the earliest Bitcoiners as discussed in the mailing list before launch). A criminal company prints the Tethers which is then flooded across the scam exchanges to fuel price manipulation.

Tether is the Fed equivalent of printing funny money. Fed prints to dictate worldwide markets and cripples or remedies them. Tether prints to prop up the BTC value and absorb dumps.

Losing 50% of something when the inflation is 6-7% is one of the most laughable things I have ever seen and no Bitcoiner talks this stupid.

The most recent application for BTC ETF was rejected for these exact reasons earlier this week.

Also 1 BTC != 1 BTC. It is the original Non Fungible Token.

https://sethforprivacy.com/posts/fungibility-graveyard/

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Do you have the link that this screenshot is from? I was able to pull up citation 69 but not 68.

The fungibility distinction from that website was something I did not know to the detail that it was outlined. Interesting data point, thanks for posting.
 
tifoji said:
January 20 , Another BTC ETF denied due to scammers like some posters in this thread trying to proselytize people and taking advantage of potential newcomers into this space. Call them out. Currently there are no rules for the crypto space otherwise they would be in jail trying to give unauthorized financial advice.

"BTC is a savings account" -> Says no one with with half a brain where savings account gets slashed by 50% in a month for no fault of theirs. While if they hold on to their assets in theory they depreciate by inflation (which sucks) but nothing like this criminal ongoing ponzi scammers who took over BTC. Typically you will never see them talk about the scamming angle. Their hideout is always 1 BTC = 1 BTC (proven false narrative) or Have Fun Staying Poor or other garbage like this. They don't have a meaningful role whatsover and hope about moon days ahead at the expense of those who come in later at fraud levels.

Ever hear of a savings account where once you give your account#, your entire financial history is linked to you forever and Chainanalysis and other companies benefitting from it? Ever hear of someone saying my AAPL Jan 21 PUT is going down because no new money is coming in? There is a very well known financial instrument where no new money coming in cripples it, someone who had an idea about arbitrage opportunity with international stamps long time ago.

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I'm reading through this now but came across this in a news summary;
"The filing did not meet "the requirement that the rules of a national securities exchange be 'designed to prevent fraudulent and manipulative acts and practices' and 'to protect investors and the public interest,'" the SEC said.

That's a little rich coming from a regulator that turns a blind-eye to HFT's and latency arbitrage. Also the GME/AMC spectacle this past year reveals some of the dark underbelly and hypocrisy of tradfi.


Canada doesn't seem to have the same concerns that the SEC does;
https://www.marketsmedia.com/fidelity-launches-spot-bitcoin-etf-in-canada/
 
tifoji said:
Yes it is an excerpt from this full release from the November rejection

https://www.sec.gov/rules/sro/cboebzx/2021/34-93559.pdf
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It appears that the central issue is:

"Listing exchanges have also attempted to demonstrate that other means besides surveillance-sharing agreements will be sufficient to prevent fraudulent and manipulative acts and practices, including that the bitcoin market as a whole or the relevant underlying bitcoin market is “uniquely” and “inherently” resistant to fraud and manipulation. 20 In response, the Commission has agreed that, if a listing exchange could establish that the underlying market inherently possesses a unique resistance to manipulation beyond the protections that are utilized by traditional commodity or securities markets, it would not necessarily need to enter into a surveillance-sharing agreement with a regulated significant market.21 Such resistance to fraud and manipulation, however, must be novel and beyond those protections that exist in traditional commodity markets or equity markets for which the Commission has long required surveillance sharing agreements in the context of listing derivative securities products. No listing exchange has satisfied its burden to make such demonstration.22"

Seems like a catch-22. Further in the doc, a BTC ETF would bring cash volume and reduce manipulation but they want to see cash volume before approval.
 
Sprout said:
I'm reading through this now but came across this in a news summary;
"The filing did not meet "the requirement that the rules of a national securities exchange be 'designed to prevent fraudulent and manipulative acts and practices' and 'to protect investors and the public interest,'" the SEC said.

That's a little rich coming from a regulator that turns a blind-eye to HFT's and latency arbitrage. Also the GME/AMC spectacle this past year reveals some of the dark underbelly and hypocrisy of tradfi.


Canada doesn't seem to have the same concerns that the SEC does;
https://www.marketsmedia.com/fidelity-launches-spot-bitcoin-etf-in-canada/
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Totally agree and there are obvious political factors going on behind the scenes, but we can only speculate on that until proof comes out someday. Sadly what happens in US is the main factor on how the markets will play out. Most of the important chips are here given major Eastern markets are trying to stifle crypto.
 
Sprout said:
It appears that the central issue is:

"Listing exchanges have also attempted to demonstrate that other means besides surveillance-sharing agreements will be sufficient to prevent fraudulent and manipulative acts and practices, including that the bitcoin market as a whole or the relevant underlying bitcoin market is “uniquely” and “inherently” resistant to fraud and manipulation. 20 In response, the Commission has agreed that, if a listing exchange could establish that the underlying market inherently possesses a unique resistance to manipulation beyond the protections that are utilized by traditional commodity or securities markets, it would not necessarily need to enter into a surveillance-sharing agreement with a regulated significant market.21 Such resistance to fraud and manipulation, however, must be novel and beyond those protections that exist in traditional commodity markets or equity markets for which the Commission has long required surveillance sharing agreements in the context of listing derivative securities products. No listing exchange has satisfied its burden to make such demonstration.22"

Seems like a catch-22. Further in the doc, a BTC ETF would bring cash volume and reduce manipulation but they want to see cash volume before approval.
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Great points again. The Futures ETF seems to be doing well in terms of cash flows and may be a positive factor down the road.
 
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