Bitcoin forks: Money for nothing, sex for free
- Thread starter Pekelo
- Start date
So... what's the purpose exactly with these forks?
I thought the first one... the split to Bitcoin Cash, was about freeing up space.. .bandwith so to say... to allow more/bigger transactions?
Then there's on coming up in November.... .segway split? Why is that split?
And this one coming up now, into Bitcoin Gold... why exactly is that happening?
So far to me, it looks like some people have just found a new way to make more money on the back of Bitcoin... creating new coins out of thin air, with an immediate market for it, since most Bitcoin holders are already involved people...
Doesn't add up either... like @Pekelo says.. the sum of both should be the value before the split. Like with a stock split or a spin-off. Although, with a spinoff.. you could argue that the companies separated have more value due to focussed management etc....
What's the story with these forks and hwy does it immediately create value? Just because doesn't count...
I thought the first one... the split to Bitcoin Cash, was about freeing up space.. .bandwith so to say... to allow more/bigger transactions?
Then there's on coming up in November.... .segway split? Why is that split?
And this one coming up now, into Bitcoin Gold... why exactly is that happening?
So far to me, it looks like some people have just found a new way to make more money on the back of Bitcoin... creating new coins out of thin air, with an immediate market for it, since most Bitcoin holders are already involved people...
Doesn't add up either... like @Pekelo says.. the sum of both should be the value before the split. Like with a stock split or a spin-off. Although, with a spinoff.. you could argue that the companies separated have more value due to focussed management etc....
What's the story with these forks and hwy does it immediately create value? Just because doesn't count...
Bitcoin Gold is the brainchild of Jack Liao and is launching as a hard fork of Bitcoin. The goal of BTG is to become a better gold than Bitcoin. The chief way they have decided to do this is trying to solve miner centralization through a proof-of-work change
So... someone just decided that he could 'fork' off some coins, because the mining process is more fair to the public and uhm... give himself 1% in premining... (how much is that).
I'm just shaking me head. I just cannot believe that that's the way it works.
So you've got a public, who totally believes in digital coins... who still think it's got a limited supply and therefore are very much like gold and that gives it value.... who are being pushed into another coin that will absolutely work, because of the gullibility of these people... and that's all absolutely not weird at all....
This guy, Jack Liao... is going to create thin air... out of thin air!!!!
It's a hack, like you've found a hack to create new coins or points in a game... and they're doing it right in front of everyone and it's all fine... because they are willing to pay for it anyway.
This doco at time point 27:14 very much reminds me of where we're getting to now. There's pretty random people who are just quitting their jobs, thinking about 'trading digital coins' for a living... people with kids etc.... Just like the 90's people are just piling up into it just because it's going up. Hey, maybe we're not at the top yet... but it sure looks like this bit from 20 years ago! (courtesy to @Pekelo for pointing to this in another thread)
So... someone just decided that he could 'fork' off some coins, because the mining process is more fair to the public and uhm... give himself 1% in premining... (how much is that).
I'm just shaking me head. I just cannot believe that that's the way it works.
So you've got a public, who totally believes in digital coins... who still think it's got a limited supply and therefore are very much like gold and that gives it value.... who are being pushed into another coin that will absolutely work, because of the gullibility of these people... and that's all absolutely not weird at all....
This guy, Jack Liao... is going to create thin air... out of thin air!!!!
It's a hack, like you've found a hack to create new coins or points in a game... and they're doing it right in front of everyone and it's all fine... because they are willing to pay for it anyway.
This doco at time point 27:14 very much reminds me of where we're getting to now. There's pretty random people who are just quitting their jobs, thinking about 'trading digital coins' for a living... people with kids etc.... Just like the 90's people are just piling up into it just because it's going up. Hey, maybe we're not at the top yet... but it sure looks like this bit from 20 years ago! (courtesy to @Pekelo for pointing to this in another thread)
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Because everyone likes money for nothing. The sex for free part is just extra.
But seriously, once people realized that after the split the sum is more than the previous value added together, there is no limit on possible forks. Why would be? It is like your stock paying suddenly an undeclared 10-15% dividend.
To use another analogy, bitcoin is a pimp. A pimp who gets new girls coming to him wanting to work for him. Thus bitcoin/pimp would get extra money from their earnings. The sex what the pimps get for free is just the topping on the cake.
As the thread title said, money for nothing, sex for free... Ain't we living in wonderful times?
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It’s all about entrepreneurship. Just the same as so many entrepreneurs around the world trying to build on an already existing idea (say Facebook) giving it another twist and some added features and market it. Some will succeed to eat some part of the pie, but most looses money and those companies die.
Look what happened in the years 2013-2016. Many crypto-entrepreneurs tried to copy the bitcoin success in creating their own new Alt-coin with some twist or better feature. Litecoin was the first (has faster blocktimes and could be mined on Videocards), followed by literally 1000 others. The hard part for these entrepreneurs was to market their new coin, they needed miners and users and an exchange to get it tradable. This marketing is actually very hard but talented entrepreneurs and a really useful added feature could succeed more or less (Monero and Dash for instance focused on anonymity something that bitcoin lacks). The hardest part is to get your new coin listed on a major and regulated exchange (it took Litecoin 4 years), most will not pass the stage of shady exchanges or don’t even manage to get an exchange at all and quickly die. Once on an exchange it’s supply and demand to uncover its value.
Anyway, although it’s very easy to copy the opensource bitcoin code, it’s very hard to add a useful innovation and get it marketed to a success (just like the next Facebook clone).
But now in 2017 we see a new way to release and market an alt-coin. By not only copying the source-code (plus adding features) but also copying the bitcoin Blockchain as a startpoint. By using the existing Blockchain, these entrepreneurs try to kickstart their new alt-coin, widely distributed among all crypto users around the world (what is actually a much fairer way than before). The entrepreneur still has a hard job to get its new coin listed on as many as possible Exchanges, but hopes that all the existing Blockchain owners ask exchanges to quote their new (free) coins. If that happens it’s again the law of supply and demand to uncover the value of the new added features.
It’s by the way very expensive for an exchange to add support to a copied/forked bitcoin-blockchain, so this will not fly out off control. Only a few entrepreneurs will succeed if they add some really useful feature which generate real demand. It’s just the same as 2013-2016 with all those alt-coins.
Your questions about this next Forked alt-coin “bitcoinGold”. The added feature/changed is a POW (proof of work) algorithm that only can by mined on cheap PC’s. Actually the same feature why Litecoin became popular 4 years ago, among the poor people around the world. This can indeed be successful in countries like Venezuela if the Entrepreneur can reach those people.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-22/number-bitcoin-miners-venezuela-swells-100000
Same as that MLM-schemes (of which many are pyramid-schemes) as entrepreneurship? And the same as Maddoff showed excellent entrepreneurial skills?
Sure, the programmers involved in this technology have a certain skill set that they are applying. I surely can't do it... but they still create something out of nothing that people want as a speculative virtual object...
And I get that as well... these guys dive right into the demand and deliver a supply... but that doesn't mean that the demand side is not completely blindsided. They are being sold a hype, through very extensive marketing.... build from within a community that's driven to make money in digital/virtual coins/assets.
The initial idea was good... brilliant really. The follow-up created a little cult that was eager to explore. What came next completely degraded this idea, by multiplying these virtual assets out of nothing into unlimited size... building blocks of air onto other blocks of air... That first ideological idea is being taken advantage of by (very smart) people that saw the pull from the public and that public's blind follow of anything related to this idea.
You then start going into waters filled with scammers. Look at this company, ... USI TECH. Created by a few people known for creating money-schemes... it's nothing much more than a MLM trick, focussed on bitcoin and the likes. Would you call them entrepreneurs as well? I would call them roaches that feed on the blind willingness of the stupid....
The bitcoin idea is going bust... the technology behind it will last, but the idea itself is rich with fraudulent behavior and people.... and there is no doubt in my mind that at one point in time it will completely fail and prices will evaporate as soon as the big holders dump everything.
It's happened before and will happen again and again and again. Whether in bitcoin, some gold-certificate scheme, stock pump-and-dump schemes, MLM, pyramid-schemes... There is nothing new under the sun....
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Because everyone likes money for nothing. The sex for free part is just extra.
But seriously, once people realized that after the split the sum is more than the previous value added together, there is no limit on possible forks. Why would be? It is like your stock paying suddenly an undeclared 10-15% dividend.
To use another analogy, bitcoin is a pimp. A pimp who gets new girls coming to him wanting to work for him. Thus bitcoin/pimp would get extra money from their earnings. The sex what the pimps get for free is just the topping on the cake.
As the thread title said, money for nothing, sex for free... Ain't we living in wonderful times?
I agree with this... Would be best if handled as a stock split, where the value of Bitcoin actually suffered. As it stands however, the new coin is more than likely destined for the gutter, with the newbies funding the profit takers. Btc gold has the advantage of being attractive to miners, but don't think it offers much else.
Segwit is supposed to offer tech improvements, which makes me wonder if the improved coin will remain as Bitcoin, and the current one will become Bitcoin classic just like with ethereum. Classic isn't worth much compared to the improved coin.
That's the problem with non financially experienced majority traders in Bitcoin. It's not a question whether it should or should not be treated as a stock-split.. it is the same... well, maybe spin-off sounds more like it though.
The reason BTC price is not adjusted is because everybody just buys it anyway... either misunderstanding the workings of a split/spin-off or just pushing it up either way.
In stocks, there is a broader base with knowledge and more reasoning about what the value is... and arbitrage forces it back in line.
Less liquidity, ease of price manipulation and a public without financial experience/knowledge makes these 'corporate actions' within bitcoin very inefficient. And you can't do much about it... since you would need to short one or both legs, which in a volatile market like BTC just doesn't work. Too many outliers...