Beware of this behaviour

Overnight said:
What he did was not spoofing.

This is...

https://www.cmegroup.com/notices/disciplinary/2023/06/CBOT-19-1224-BC-GREGORY-WASSERMAN.html

A $150,000 fine and a perma-ban from CME derivatives trading.
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From the original link:

No person shall enter or cause to be entered an order with the intent, at the time of order entry, to cancel the order before execution or to modify the order to avoid execution;

From your link:

No person shall enter or cause to be entered an order with the intent, at the time of order entry, to cancel the order before execution or to modify the order to avoid execution;

It is the same text buddy
 
Yes. But this is not the definition of spoofing. It's the legal base that permits to sanction a good bunch of manipulative techniques : spoofing, layering, fake orders during pre open to look for iceberg or stop orders, this technique we are talking about...
 
MarkBrown said:
YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS EVERY DAY TO RETAIL TRADERS....LOL





Spoofing the market refers to a form of market manipulation where a trader places a large number of orders with the intention of creating a false impression of demand or supply, only to cancel them before execution. This deceptive practice aims to trick other market participants into buying or selling securities based on the false appearance of market interest.

Here’s how spoofing typically works:

  1. Placing Fake Orders: A trader places large buy or sell orders on one side of the market to create the illusion of strong demand or supply. These orders are not meant to be executed but are used to manipulate the market price.

  2. Influencing Market Behavior: The visible large orders can influence the behavior of other traders, leading them to believe there is a genuine interest in buying or selling. As a result, these traders might adjust their own orders, buying or selling based on this perceived demand or supply.

  3. Canceling the Fake Orders: Once the market has moved in the desired direction and other traders have acted on the false signals, the spoofer cancels the large orders. The trader may then take advantage of the manipulated price by executing smaller, opposite orders (e.g., selling at a higher price after spoofing buy orders).
Key Points About Spoofing:

  • Market Manipulation: Spoofing is illegal and considered a form of market manipulation under financial regulations in many countries, including the United States.
  • Detection: Market regulators and exchanges have systems in place to detect spoofing activities by monitoring order placement and cancellation patterns.
  • Legal Consequences: Traders found guilty of spoofing can face significant fines, penalties, and bans from trading, as well as potential criminal charges.
Impact of Spoofing:

  • Market Integrity: Spoofing undermines market integrity by creating artificial price movements, which can harm investors who make trading decisions based on misleading information.
  • Volatility: It can increase market volatility, leading to sudden price swings and reduced market stability.
  • Trust: Persistent spoofing practices can erode trust among market participants, making investors wary of market prices and transparency.
In summary, spoofing the market is a deceptive tactic used to manipulate prices for personal gain, negatively affecting market fairness and investor confidence.
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Good Evening MarkBrown,

Thank you for the advice.

I am constantly canceling limit orders trying to get better fill to avoid slippage with market orders, is this illegal to do?
 
TraDaToR said:
Yes. But this is not the definition of spoofing. It's the legal base that permits to sanction a good bunch of manipulative techniques : spoofing, layering, fake orders during pre open to look for iceberg or stop orders, this technique we are talking about...
More...
Good Evening TraDaToR,

Is this legal? I am not trying to spoof or fool anyone, but sometimes my limit orders do not get filled right away, and I have cancel the limit order.

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/beware-of-this-behaviour.380986/page-3#post-6015922
 
Drawdown Addict said:
From the original link:

No person shall enter or cause to be entered an order with the intent, at the time of order entry, to cancel the order before execution or to modify the order to avoid execution;

From your link:

No person shall enter or cause to be entered an order with the intent, at the time of order entry, to cancel the order before execution or to modify the order to avoid execution;

It is the same text buddy
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Upon further review, you are correct. I read only through the initial bit about the guy using other IDs.
 
SimpleMeLike said:
Good Evening TraDaToR,

Is this legal? I am not trying to spoof or fool anyone, but sometimes my limit orders do not get filled right away, and I have cancel the limit order.

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/beware-of-this-behaviour.380986/page-3#post-6015922
More...

You can cancel your limit orders all you want as long as you wanted the order to be executed when you entered it. What is prohibited is to place orders for the sole purpose of influencing the order book and canceling them when you obtained the desired effect. That's why the original case in this thread is more in my grey area. Because most of the time you genuinely improve and compete with a bot until you realize he went too far...
 
TraDaToR said:
You can cancel your limit orders all you want as long as you wanted the order to be executed when you entered it. What is prohibited is to place orders for the sole purpose of influencing the order book and canceling them when you obtained the desired effect. That's why the original case in this thread is more in my grey area. Because most of the time you genuinely improve and compete with a bot until you realize he went too far...
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Good Morning TraDaToR,

Happy Labor Day.

Thank for the response.

I enter limit orders trying to get filled for my trading strategy, but sometimes I have to cancel the order, because my orders is not filled. I do not want to cheat to win and do all the extra fraud in trading. I trade fair.

My goal is to enter the trade, not create fake trade positions and all that stuff, so this means CME will not fine me or send me to jail, correct?

Thank you.
 
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