You lost me at "There are implications..."
Best indicators ?????????????
- Thread starter Humpy
- Start date
There was a thread recently.
The OP was talontrading.
The thread dealt with ideas and verifying the ideas.
TT gave a tip type trade to his audience.
It dealt with Level II signals at a particular undefined time of the trading cycle.
He said it could not be back tested.
Another person questioned why it could not be backtested.
I provided the back testing criteria and the results that would occur if back tested. Regard this as a factual way to achieve solving a problem. Since I was familiar, for many years, with the OP's "new and never before seen" free tip type trade, I also gave the data on its use (since I use it many times a day (up to 40) for longer than most people have been around.
My post was deleted by ET staff. ET staff are the people who delete posts.
The OP edited my post severely to remove the back testing criteria.
Then he stated it could not be back tested.
Another thing happened as well. The thread was abruptly closed.
This in some way may be construed as ET mamagement's way of shooting the messenger upon advice of an OP who is unable to consider all points of view.
You may have skimmed my post and misunderstood my poor expository style and citicism. Its nothing to concern yourself about. My other comments probably did not come across either. Indicators are a wonderful asset to traders. They have many leading characterisitcs. As a consequence when used in the non probabilistic paradigm of the P, V relationship of the markets; they are flawless for trading when precision is involved several shells out from a core logic.
There is a myth in the CW. Users feel CW is correct and depicts the market. They use this myth as a standard against which to measure. It is called: garbage in ....garbage out.
When prediction is examined it is found to be unnecessary. The use of probability is also unnecessary when it is examined in the face of alternatives like sufficiency and certainty.
Indicators are derived from volume and price using different forms of mathematics. We see that you are acquainted with mathematics in some unusual ways. I am trained in theoretical physics among other things. Its application in markets is a great source of humor to many of us.
I have a few degrees and I am scientifically oriented to problem solving. In 1957, I looked at the markets offer and decided to take it. Attached is the left half of a chart I inked on vellum in 1957 so I could make brownlines to chart daily bars upon. Notice the top is price and the bottom is volume. P and V are the variables of the market. Science is methodical. Deduction is used.
If you cannot understand what I have written, do not worry about it. In your case I will explain what this sentence means. I do "work" to learn the markets. I work scientifically as a problem solver. I have the answer to three questions all the time, the questions I can answer all the time are:
1. Where in the cycle is the market?
2. What is next in the cycle? and
3. How fast are things changing?
For me, the answers are CERTAIN and in the Present. For me the future comes into the Present and fills the container I have built for volume and price.
So far, I have let you know that indicators are very precision tools that lead the market. I know how and why to use them. I have invented several as well.
Some people feel indicators, by their nature, are lagging. This problem that they have is in their genes as well as their learned character and beliefs. They made the choices that got them to where they are. they also get the consequences of their choices.
In common units, bar volatility is greater than trending slope; therefore indicators have to be tuned to the cycle. If not, commonly indicator "bridge" cycles. I had to tune my indicators as a consequence. I also had to use "in kind" (Keynes) measureds (signals). Two line indicators display 6 cases of their relationship possibilities. This is in parallel to the 9 possible cases displayed by adjacent bars.
Lets say peoiple who read what I am saying have a choice. They can say "gibberish". they can say WTF? They can moderate and delete my post. They can edit my post. They can reiterate their prior position. they can abruptly close the thread.
They can think. They can wait. They can reread. They can unconsiously get a feeling.
They can question. They can formula a back test. They can try it out. They can finally buy a colored printer. They can learn to learn. They can work. They can do drills.
They can make 46,500 dollars in 126 minutes with 20,000 dollars margin.
They can shoot the messenger.....LOL.....
The chart above mentioned.
Quote from RCG Trader:
Jack has not mastered the art of adjusting language to fit his audience, however, his teaching are very solid TA.
Channels
Volume analysis
1-2-3 points
Ranking instruments based on volatility.
He does not give the grail to trading, which is proper pyramiding and proper risk management, but he give a good start to how to read the market.
Jack seems to polarize a lot of people wherever he goes. What gets me is why these individuals bother to try to debunk him. He is not going to stop, and neither are his adherents.
Its not like he has declared jihad or something
Dose he just teach and talk or does he have an actual objective trading sysem and if so how effective and profitable is it?
For example: Annual percentage increase in account capital, gross Win/Loss ratio in dollars, etc, etc..... an objective measure.
The point I am making is that we are not at GS, C, or BAC.
This is Elite Trader.
A message board.
Personally if I were to reveal a system, or any information at all, it is not incumbent upon me to prove anything to anyone, as I am not trying to get clients. No one is paying me.
Ideas are like anything else in the free market.
Caveat Emptor.
If someone does not like what I cooking, they are free to move on to another kitchen, and nothing is lost by me or you.
I did not charge u to consume anything I serve.
It is not logical to become obsessed with the writings of another, unless some sort of contract, real or implied, was broken.
As far as I can tell no contract was offered, and as this is not a courtroom, one cannot perjure themselves here.
Again, Caveat Emptor.
Very perceptive.
Imagine the chart filled in for stocks in 1957. the 11 by 17 sheet holds 6 months. I would have 5 cycles showing and use that info as a template for each stock. I chose what toady is called high Beta high quality stocks.
decades past and the PC was invented so was the copier and printer.
Real time charts became possible. I used them and I also used my approach.
30 years into trading, electronics had sufficient utility to be useful. The Principles never changed, however.
Attached is a modern chart and it is annotated a little bit. I'll send the log next; it is in crappy handwriting and abreviated because we have an "easy" market today (the tells of the cycles are self evident).
Quote from jack hershey:
Very perceptive.
Imagine the chart filled in for stocks in 1957. the 11 by 17 sheet holds 6 months. I would have 5 cycles showing and use that info as a template for each stock. I chose what toady is called high Beta high quality stocks.
decades past and the PC was invented so was the copier and printer.
Real time charts became possible. I used them and I also used my approach.
30 years into trading, electronics had sufficient utility to be useful. The Principles never changed, however.
Attached is a modern chart and it is annotated a little bit. I'll send the log next; it is in crappy handwriting and abreviated because we have an "easy" market today (the tells of the cycles are self evident).
Here is the "light weight" log to just show bar by bar and not even show YM leading ES after the initial synch of the markets. Where you see P on volume, this is the END of the long cycle that followed the opening FTT's on Tape, BBT and sub.