Best Country for Trading (Tax efficiency)

[swinging tick]

Thai residency for cash:
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/...idency-in-thailand-for-60000-2017-4?r=US&IR=T

From what I remember, they used to issue long term visas to people with money, now they give "residency" visas. That's a good development

"While perhaps not as tax efficient as your idea, it doesn't lock you to any one country, and gives you the security of the EU and currency movements...

As people mentioned here before, if you are a trader, tax authorities in the country of your actual residency would still have the right to fully tax you, since trading income is local. Althou if you are a PT and given that most countries don't bother to check what their visitors are doing, one can fly under radar for now.
This setup would work for people with other type of businesses probably.

I wonder about this:
When you open bank acct, now most banks ask you to sign in the agreement that you are paying taxes on that money (otherwise they can freeze your acct). So if you show them this Estonian Corp setup, that you paid taxes in Estonia on distributed profits - would that be enough for them, or would they try to dig dipper? I mean since they'll know that you are a trader, would they want to check if you are actual resident of Estonia?

 

[Van_der_Voort_4]

I would suggest to consider Hungary.New corporate tax at 9% and personal income tax at 15%.
Well positioned in Central Europe,you have want to see Champions League football you go on the plane and are back same evening,you want to buy a boat or a yacht Adriatic Coast is not far away.Going skiing to Austria or Swiss Alps no problem, day's drive with you whole family.Budapest is very beautiful city,many parks Normofa Park,Margitsziget (Margaret Island),it was called jewel of the empire only century ago.City has good transport system,metro and trams are excellent,private schools for your children and if you live on Buda side you have a view of the whole city from your window.Many foreigners here from all over,Russians,Israelis,Brazilians of European decent,Germans.Also the good thing food markets well spread out with fresh meat and vegetables from local farmers.

The most important thing is money,new corporate tax rate of 9% and 15% on personal income

https://www.ft.com/content/302fa4b4-acda-11e6-9cb3-bb8207902122
https://www.ft.com/content/302fa4b4-acda-11e6-9cb3-bb8207902122
https://www2.deloitte.com/content/d...ments/Tax/dttl-tax-hungaryhighlights-2017.pdf

Every second day when on the tram i hear Americans speak,i am kind of surprised by that.Unfortunately investors visa program is at the moment suspended.There was a debate in Parliament about that, I am not native Hungarian so i don't follow politics here.

http://www.residency-bond.eu/residency-bond-program.html

 

[luisHK]

When you open bank acct, now most banks ask you to sign in the agreement that you are paying taxes on that money (otherwise they can freeze your acct). So if you show them this Estonian Corp setup, that you paid taxes in Estonia on distributed profits - would that be enough for them, or would they try to dig dipper? I mean since they'll know that you are a trader, would they want to check if you are actual resident of Estonia?

Don t expect the banks not to dig deeper, they might even dig deeper than the law request them. Was in HK today and the banker insists to get TIN from my native country and insists they need to declare myaccount there because of CRS - despite me having no link with said country. No assets nor business there and hardly spend 10days a year there.
Some banks are requesting foreign HK residents to supply what they call a Proof of permanent adress, ie a proof of adress in their native country, no matter they live in HK and deny account opening when they can t supply it. Read about some european consulate which saw many of its citizens moving to HK having their personal application declined hinting they should just fabricate the said adress proof.
No idea which law banks are interpreting in.such a way to come up with such a strange request.
It s still possible to open non resident accounts btw in HK, some of the requirements like the permanent adress might be waived also, or just never be mentioned, depending on the account tier ,other relationships with that bank and sometimes simply the rm one is talking to, but it is sure complicated and weird to run accounts under those conditions.
Some countries still appear easier as well, banking in.HK have had the reputation to be particulary complicated, but one shouldn t bet now a bank won t dig deeper.

 

[swinging tick]

Luis, thanks!
Yea, that's the f-n bureaucratic world we live in. Few decades ago HK and CH banks used to be synonymous with privacy and bank secrecy. Now they are just busybodies working for the governments..

 

[luisHK]

Well, you are only kindda welcome, I whish I had better news to share - those offshore banks must be sharing this pain as well, their business has gotten tougher over the last few years

As of declaring to one's country of origin on top of their country of residence, I'm not sure how it will work, it seems that banks need to declare the accounts to their national financial authority, which than will spread the information with foreign authorities supposed to receive it, according to rules national authorities understand probably better than zealous banks afraid to be sanctionned.

 

[MoneyWalks]

Don t expect the banks not to dig deeper, they might even dig deeper than the law request them. Was in HK today and the banker insists to get TIN from my native country and insists they need to declare myaccount there because of CRS - despite me having no link with said country. No assets nor business there and hardly spend 10days a year there............

Hi Luis,

Thank you for sharing your experience. Can you please update up if you succeeded in opening the HK bank account? Also was is a simple offshore private account or corporate account?

I'm a little bit nervous because in coming month I'm planning to visit HK right now I'm in the process of incorporating an offshore business there. My register agents are the guys from Bridges.hk and I've read some good reviews that they can help you with HK banking. I'm hoping they can help me as well, we'll see.

I don't have a TIN number from my home country either.

For Hong Kong company the business registration (BR) number of the company will be the TIN (Tax identification number).

 

[luisHK]

This was a non resident personal account, opened in 2016 actually, and as it happened in another bank a few months earlier, more questions were asked upon applying for a credit card than when opening the account (the issues coming from residency rather than financial guarantees). It is still fine to open non resident personal accounts, although different banks and branches might have different policies - midsize accounts seem to be easier to open, as banks seem to shun smaller accouts, possibly because of higher compliance costs making those unprofitable, and Private Banking accounts require a more complete KYC.
Corporate accounts for shell companies are tough to open in HK, but I have had very little experience with those recently, and having a quick look at Bridges website, it's possible that they make the corporation look not like a shell company . I have friends with proper companies in China that use HK registered shell companies for invoicing and tax purpose, without yet banking issue in HK, but some of those use expensive full service providers -actually plenty of China based businesses bill overseas customers through HK corporations and I haven't heard of too many disaster stories there, although some accounts have been closed, but I'm not privvy to their banking arrangements.
Some banks are also apparently still open for business, if Bridges has good reviews, they might be working with those banks, I'll be curious to read feedback from your experience there. Also many private banks can open accounts to offshore entities when it comes to investment 1 man corporations and that person can show the money is legitimate and the structure not aimed at tax evasion - which is something hardly anybody seemed to care about in HK only 3 to 5 years ago.

 

[luisHK]

About the TIN number, this is an issue that has been bugging me since that meeting and had some discussion about it, although not directly with bankers.
Most banks in AEOI signatories countries now ask their customers to fill a tax residency self declaration, and ask for the TIN number. There are plenty of expats without TIN, it is not clear all banks as of today accept those customers and their explanation, and it is even less clear they will accept them in the future, some claim those customers's might be asked to close their account within a couple of years as compliance get even stricter.
Also about the HK registered company, with the BR used as a TIN number, if that's the case that's different from the certificate of tax residency, on Talkgold Taxes forum there is poster whose large customer in the EU asked for his HK company to forward a certificate of Tax residency, but HK tax authorities wouldn't issue it as its company does't have enough physical activity in HK. I used to be more active in trading goods between Asia and EU a few years back and already received enquiries from a large EU company to which a shell HK company couldn't reply satisfactorily, I suspect it is just getting worse now, so those are more problems you might encounter if you are doing business through a shell HK corporation.
Good luck anyway, and while more complicated, it appears that a whole bunch of businesses are still thriving in the region, so there must be ways to sort out all those extra regulatory barriers.

 

[meyer]

You have talked a little bit about Dubai here so I would like to ask a few questions for those who knows something about that city. I am thinking about moving there soon. The taxes in my country are crazy.
1. Could I open a company in free zone and manage the money to other firms without any special licence or paying any tax? Now I have 2 clients (one from Europe, one from BVI).
2. Could I easly invest my own money as a individual without any taxes? Do I need to show my personal income at the end of the year to the authorities ?
3. Could I sell my bitcoins (7 figures) as a individual without any accuses of money laundering ? I do not have any proves that I bought it 5 years ago.
4. Could I open a holding company that invest without any taxes on the whole world ?
5. Could I have a few bank accounts in different counties as a UAE tax residend?

 

[luisHK]

Interesting questions, I'm curious to read the answers, I would post this in the forum below though if I were you, where several agents and clients involved with UAE are active:

http://www.talkgold.com/forum/f22-.html