Best Country for Trading (Tax efficiency)

[dw31583]

An OCDE link about the AEOI, did I understand it properly or it's way less worrysone than we heard so far ? China, UAE are signatories but have signed 0 bilateral agreements to activate the automatic exchange and there are a bunch of other countries among the only 50 or so listed countries in the same situation (some offshore centers have signed plenty of those agreements though, not sure how they affect corporate set ups):


http://www.oecd.org/tax/automatic-e...framework-for-the-crs/exchange-relationships/


As of getting taxed while holidaying in HK on one's trading gains while the ird hardly bother the locals (there's no cap gain tax in Hk). Sure, that's a scary prospect...
DW, or the tax and sexual repression black swan at every corner

Btw if this makes you happy, there are countries which will not exchange information automatically however those are the countries where you don't really want to keep your money:

https://thebanks.eu/articles/countries-which-will-not-automatically-exchange-account-information

 

[luisHK]

The guy who doesn't believe to the HK tax authorities website, the guy who thinks that sex outside of marriage is legal in the UAE (.

Glad to see DW you are back from holidays - so am i actually.

I wished you were the man who could point us to instances of western men getting arrested for sex outside wedlock in Dubai ( in a private place) or tourists getting taxed on their trading income while vacationing in HK.But never mind, you are the Taleb of sex and information exchange.

Besides here it's link to the thread where I picked up the OECD link, they seem to disagree with you . besides I have lots of concerns about money but I must say AEOI or taxations on my investments income are not on top of the list, and don't need to move accounts for that reason.

http://www.talkgold.com/forum/r482219-.html

To be fair I read and heard even in China about the AEOI, so the information floating around is a bit contradictory - about China it seems the banks are not ready for it, and the way it looks now is China might use its might and not offer reciprocity in the exchange, this wouldn't be the first field it happens. I can see HK banks getting pressure first and foremost to share information with the Mainland, if they don't do that already.

As of Taiwan which appears on the list of countries which won't share the information, it has been a large offshore center for many years, particulary to park offshore RMBs , the only good reason imo one might not want to park money there is a lack of chinese language skills, which make dealing with local banks very dificult.

 

[dw31583]

I wished you were the man who could point us to instances of western men getting arrested for sex outside wedlock in the Dubai ( in a private place) or tourists getting taxed on their trading income while vacationing in HK.But never mind, you are the Taleb of sex and information exchange.

Besides here it's link to the thread where I picked up the OECD link, they seem to disagree with you . besides I have lots of concerns about money but I must say AEOI or taxations on my investments income are not on top of the list, and don't need to change accounts for that reason.

http://www.talkgold.com/forum/r482219-.html

You're just playing a game buddy. Using words and parts of sentences out of context is meaningless. Who said that tourists will be taxed on their trading income? They won't because there is a double tax treaty and 99.99% of the tourists who are trading in their hotel room lives in countries where they already pay taxes, consequently the HK (or US, UK, French, etc.) tax authorities are not spying on tourists to determine wether they generate locally sourced income or not because chances are they pay taxes somewhere else and they would use that as a credit against the local tax payable. Btw I've told this to you about a 100 times. This is only dangerous if you are PT and you don't pay taxes anywhere but you're trading.

Furthermore, I don't care about the OECD CRS. According to every single bank I have an account with, they're going to start the exchange of information in 2017 and 2018 respectively. I believe both the OECD and the banks in those jurisdictions.

Btw, the famous Dubai, that you like so much, put a woman into the jail because she has been raped. Yes, raped! And according to them it's sex outside of marriage. Well done Dubai.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38013351

 

[dw31583]

Glad to see DW you are back from holidays - so am i actually.

I wished you were the man who could point us to instances of western men getting arrested for sex outside wedlock in Dubai ( in a private place) or tourists getting taxed on their trading income while vacationing in HK.But never mind, you are the Taleb of sex and information exchange.

Besides here it's link to the thread where I picked up the OECD link, they seem to disagree with you . besides I have lots of concerns about money but I must say AEOI or taxations on my investments income are not on top of the list, and don't need to move accounts for that reason.

http://www.talkgold.com/forum/r482219-.html

To be fair I read and heard even in China about the AEOI, so the information floating around is a bit contradictory - about China it seems the banks are not ready for it, and the way it looks now is China might use its might and not offer reciprocity in the exchange, this wouldn't be the first field it happens.

As of Taiwan which appears on the list of countries which won't share the information, it has been a large offshore center for many years, particulary to park offshore RMBs for many years now, the only good reason imo one might not want to park money there is a lack of chinese language skills, which make dealing with local banks very dificult.

Taiwan is a good option indeed but you seem to forget something: you need both a bank and a brokerage account in a non participating jurisdiction otherwise it's worthless. Let's say you have a bank account in Taipei with Sinopac but your brokerage account is somewhere else then it won't solve anything and the problem is, I couldn't find any reputable broker in the non participating jurisdictions.

Except the US which is the biggest tax haven, for now.

 

[luisHK]

You're just playing a game buddy. Using words and parts of sentences out of context is meaningless. Who said that tourists will be taxed on their trading income? They won't because there is a double tax treaty and 99.99% of the tourists who are trading in their hotel room lives in countries where they already pay taxes, consequently the HK (or US, UK, French, etc.) tax authorities are not spying on tourists to determine wether they generate locally sourced income or not because chances are they pay taxes somewhere else and they would use that as a credit against the local tax payable. Btw I've told this to you about a 100 times. This is only dangerous if you are PT and you don't pay taxes anywhere but you're trading.

Furthermore, I don't care about the OECD CRS. According to every single bank I have an account with, they're going to start the exchange of information in 2017 and 2018 respectively. I believe both the OECD and the banks in those jurisdictions.

Btw, the famous Dubai, that you like so much, put a woman into the jail because she has been raped. Yes, raped! And according to them it's sex outside of marriage. Well done Dubai.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38013351

Yes, I mentionned before the issue about women getting raped before, that's not what I'm asking for you to point out. Last we heard you were worried of getting arrested for bringing home a gorgeous blonde in a ferrari or other fast toy.

As of playing with words, now the authorities are not spying on tourists on which I agree, so who while travelling through HK ever got taxed on his trading income -and if you think 99.99% of the people travelling to HK live in countries where they pay taxes on their trading, you probably know Hk as Well as Dubai, but that's OK, I'd guessed that much.

 

[dw31583]

Yes, I mentionned before the issue about women getting raped before, that's not what I'm asking for you to point out. Last we heard you were worried of getting arrested for bringing home a gorgeous blonde in a ferrari or other fast toy.

As of playing with words, now the authorities are not spying on tourists on which I agree, so who while travelling through HK ever got taxed on his trading income -and if you think 99.99% of the people travelling to HK live in countries where they pay taxes on their trading, you probably know Hk as Well as Dubai, but that's OK, I'd guessed that much.

Listen, the difference between your point and mine is that you're saying your opinion while I'm pointing out the laws. Your opinion is based on chances and mine point of view is based on facts.

If you can guarantee that I won't get jailed for sex outside of marriage in Dubai if I take home a couple of hookers into my house on the Palm while driving around in my RR then I'll give you a seven figure amount because the tax savings are going to make it up

Like I said, if you don't make considerable amount of money and you don't live a lavish lifestyle and you pay your taxes somewhere then don't worry about trading anywhere. However if you're a PT and you make serious amounts (7 or 8 figures) and you spend months in one single country then you'll be in trouble if you get noticed by someone. So like I said a 100 times, they won't spy on you but you'll be in trouble if you get noticed by any reason and you made 6 or 7 figures while you were "living" there for months yet you paid nothing in taxes because you were a resident in Dubai where you spent 5 days in the year.

These are the laws. You can argue with it but the only reason why this conversation exists between us is the fact that there are laws which says what I'm saying here.

What you absolutely don't get about my point is that I'm just sharing the laws here. You can get away with many thing but I want to share the real information which is based on the laws. Once you know the laws then it's up to you how you play with it. However your point of view is plain wrong. Why?

This is you: trading is tax free in Hong Kong.
HK tax authorities website: it's taxable in Hong Kong.
You: no, it's not, no one gets taxed.
Reality: maybe, because they don't make enough to get noticed.
Me: As you can see this is all about how much you make and whether you're under the radar or not. However saying that it's tax free is plain bullsh*t.

 

[luisHK]

You are a bit tiring with the how much u make. 7 or low 8 digits is fine but quite common in HK UAE or in my residence for that matter.
I can point u to a whole bunch of people doing this kind of money , yet u can t point (internet link is fine) to a single instance of a guy getting taxed while holidaying in HK ( yes the law might state otherwise, you hinted one could be taxed there for his trading profits while staying a short time in HK). U can t point to a single western male beeing arrested in Dubai for sex outside wedlock in a Private place. But the law states otherwise.
Ok.

Now it s legal to go around with 2 blondes, expensive jewels and a supercar in Rio or Sofia and that sounds safer to u.
What are the mugging and kidnapping stats in Brazil and Bulgaria compared to UAE ?
Those are illegal btw in those three countries, but for some reason local customs and law implementation matter a lot.
Your brain is wired in a strange way if u miss that .

As of laws from OECD i.posted a link from OECD website which shows an automatic exchange more complicated than what u claim but that doesn t matter.
Fine

Too bad ur paranoia sells less than Taleb's ( I can see why though), u could entertain us with intelectual rights international tax law.

 

[dw31583]

"Your brain is wired in a strange way if u miss that."

If staying within the law is strange then I must admit that I am.

"As of laws from.OECD i.posted a link.from.OECD which shows an automatic exchange more complicated than.what u claim but that doesn t matter."

Sure, that's why bankers in your country (Hong Kong) has been moving accounts to the US since 2015.

"Too bad ur paranoia sell less than Taleb's, u could entertain us with intelectual rights internationaltax law."

I have no intention to become popular nor accepted. That's your your thing to do.

"yes the law might state otherwise"

Exactly. The law states otherwise, the opposite way to be precise.

"Now it s legal to go around with 2 blondes, expensive jewels and a supercar in Rio or.Sofia and that sounds safer to u."

Never said that. You like speaking in my name, it's called lying. I don't live in Rio nor in Bulgaria. I live in a Western country where it is indeed safe to drive a nice car and to take home women.

"yet u can t point to.a single instance of a guy getting taxed while holidaying in HK"

You're a joke. First you said that trading is tax free in HK. I proved you wrong. You went silent. Now you're trying to win the argument by saying that tourists doesn't get taxed. Indeed, they usually don't because they pay their taxes elsewhere and the ones who don't are unlikely to make so much and unlikely to stay there for so long that they get noticed. Still, the authorities has the right to tax you.

Listen, you're speaking in my name. It's lying. I never said any of those things. I said what the tax authorities says. That's it. End of the story. Basically you're arguing with me about facts. Do you understand what a fact is? A fact is for instance that the Hong Kong tax authorities website explicitly states that if someone is trading in HK whether a resident or non resident then s/he is liable to pay taxes on that income. I never said that how many people get caught. You're the person who are talking about that. I'm just talking about the laws. Stop speaking in my name and stop lying about things I've never said.

You want to win an argument that you can't win. Why? Not because of me. Because of the laws. You're talking about chances / probabilities while I'm doing nothing else than repeating what laws says. If you want to win this argument that you lost before you started then visit your nearest tax office and ask them the same questions. You're arguing against the written laws, not against me.

Btw, Dubai. Let's see what the UK says: https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/united-arab-emirates/local-laws-and-customs

Well, it seems like sex outside of marriage is illegal and you can spend years in the jail if you f*ck someone that isn't your wife. Are they going to spy on you? No, they're living from tourists' dollars. Are they going to investigate if someone files a compliant? They'll be obligated.

 

[luisHK]

"
"Now it s legal to go around with 2 blondes, expensive jewels and a supercar in Rio or.Sofia and that sounds safer to u."

Never said that. You like speaking in my name, it's called lying. I don't live in Rio nor in Bulgaria. I live in a Western country where it is indeed safe to drive a nice car and to take home women.

Not gonna go through this whole post tonight, a few pages earlier you said you would move to Brazil in a heartbeat if it was tax free, actually at least for the second time in this thread. Talk about a backpedalling liar, or maybe reading all those laws not only damaged your critical thinking but also ravaged your memory ?

I didn't say that trading in Hk is tax free, although the people paying tax on their trading profits are a small minority afaik, and you raved several times about people transiting (holidaying ) in a country could be hit by taxes on their trading profits.

So now that you have come up with a bunch of laws (never mind for Brazil they were refuted by Daal and in the list you send me on tax advantages for expats there were mistakes as well), can you at least point us to instances those laws were applied ?

As you like laws so much, here's a bunch of them worth meditating, and countries/states to be avoided.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1568475/Ten-stupidest-laws-are-named.html

http://thoughtcatalog.com/rachel-ho...m-around-the-world-that-still-actually-exist/

 

[dw31583]

Not gonna go through this whole post tonight, a few pages earlier you said you would move to Brazil in a heartbeat if it was tax free, actually at least for the second time in this thread. Talk about a backpedalling liar.

I didn't say that trading in Hk was tax free, although the people paying tax on their trading profits are a small minority afaik, and you raved several times about people transiting (holidaying ) in a country could be hit by taxes on their trading profits.

So now that you have come up with a bunch of laws (never mind for Brazil they were refuted by Daal and in the list you send me one on tax advantages for expats there were mistakes as well), can you at least point us to instances those laws were applied ?

As you like laws so much, here's a bunch of them worth meditating, and countries/states to be avoided.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1568475/Ten-stupidest-laws-are-named.html

http://thoughtcatalog.com/rachel-ho...m-around-the-world-that-still-actually-exist/

Yes, I said that I would move there (Brazil) if it would be tax free. However I never said that I live or lived there. Those are different things.

Haha, I do remember the Singapore chewing gum laws really well. The first time I've been there I was chewing some Orbits in front of the immigration officer. I clearly remember his face. He was smiling in a strange way. Later in the city I found out that it's illegal and I can get a fine for doing it

Btw the list I sent you was correct and accurate at the time of writing. Obviously laws tend to change.

So what about Dubai then? Would you recommend living there as one would in London, New York or Moscow? I mean parties, hookers, alcohol and fancy cars? What about the local Arabs who may not like your behavior, especially those who can't afford such a lifestyle?