Another question for those who understand and believe in trinity. Why would God punish God the Son, and have it done at hands of the lowly humans who are God's creatures? Why would God punish his only Son? etc....
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Beck: Good for Jews that Jesus didnt come for payback
- Thread starter hermit
- Start date
Yeah, jem is correct
On the question of punishment for Jews/Romans/whatever, my question would be:
Would God see things the same way as humans or, conversely, do humans (even self-proclaimed "enlightened" ones) see things the same way as would God?
(And if someone answers "yes", then whom are you claiming to be the equivalent of....?)
On the question of punishment for Jews/Romans/whatever, my question would be:
Would God see things the same way as humans or, conversely, do humans (even self-proclaimed "enlightened" ones) see things the same way as would God?
(And if someone answers "yes", then whom are you claiming to be the equivalent of....?)
if you are a christian you are taugh a story boils down to this. god who is jesus got pissed at humanity so he sent himself to earth to kill himself so that he could spare man his(gods)wrath.
it all makes perfect sense to the indoctrinated mind. to the thinking mind, not so much.
the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this."
Albert Einstein
it all makes perfect sense to the indoctrinated mind. to the thinking mind, not so much.
the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this."
Albert Einstein
As much as Stu continues to lie about this... although I have corrected numerous times...
I will provide a link to anyone who wish to know whether Jesus was a historical figures....
Here is a link from wikipedia... it shows that some references are disputed... and others are undisputed.
Note... if you are included in Josephus.... you are by definition a historical figure.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus
Josephus includes information about individuals, groups, customs and geographical places. Some of these, such as the city of Seron, are not referenced in the surviving texts of any other ancient authority. His writings provide a significant, extra-Biblical account of the post-Exilic period of the Maccabees, the Hasmonean dynasty, and the rise of Herod the Great. He makes references to the Sadducees, Jewish High Priests of the time, Pharisees and Essenes, the Herodian Temple, Quirinius' census and the Zealots, and to such figures as Pontius Pilate, Herod the Great, Agrippa I and Agrippa II, John the Baptist, James the brother of Jesus, and a pair of disputed and undisputed references to Jesus (for more see Josephus on Jesus). He is an important source for studies of immediate post-Temple Judaism and the context of early Christianity
I will provide a link to anyone who wish to know whether Jesus was a historical figures....
Here is a link from wikipedia... it shows that some references are disputed... and others are undisputed.
Note... if you are included in Josephus.... you are by definition a historical figure.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus
Josephus includes information about individuals, groups, customs and geographical places. Some of these, such as the city of Seron, are not referenced in the surviving texts of any other ancient authority. His writings provide a significant, extra-Biblical account of the post-Exilic period of the Maccabees, the Hasmonean dynasty, and the rise of Herod the Great. He makes references to the Sadducees, Jewish High Priests of the time, Pharisees and Essenes, the Herodian Temple, Quirinius' census and the Zealots, and to such figures as Pontius Pilate, Herod the Great, Agrippa I and Agrippa II, John the Baptist, James the brother of Jesus, and a pair of disputed and undisputed references to Jesus (for more see Josephus on Jesus). He is an important source for studies of immediate post-Temple Judaism and the context of early Christianity
Quote from sameeh55:
A Hypothetical question, would god punish Judas for following god's wishes?
Another Hypothetical question, why did god allow Jesus to suffer in such a way for something he/ she/it wanted to have happened?
This is my view - not anyones official theology.
1. I believe -- God as Creator - is outside of time.
So he knows past present and future.
From Judas' perspective Judas does have free will and gets to make choices because Humans experience time in a linear fashion.
Judas separated himself from God with his choice.... but, God may have forgiven him... that is above my pay grade.
2. By dying he destroyed our death... by rising he restored our life.
He took our sins upon himself on the cross. That is why it was so painful.
In the old testament it was said there is no forgiveness without the shedding of blood. That was a foreshadowing.
In Egypt to have the first born plague passover... the Jews had to kill and eat an unblemished lamb and put the blood of the lame on their doorway in the shape of a cross.
Abraham was going to sacrifice his son on the same mount... but God said he would provide the sacrifice.
I see you're still pissing into the wind Jem.
One only need consider Josepheus was born 40 years after Jesus was supposed to have died and there is no other history for him to validate anything he is said to have written about Jesus.
Consequentially itâs more than a little obvious writing attributed to Josepheus is at best merely hearsay and not historical fact. Especially when most of a very small reference about jesus is known to be forgery.
There is no historicity for Jesus.
Remarkable when on thinks the bible jesus is supposed to be the savior of mankind. Yet there is no corresponding formal historical record whatsoever.
Not so surprising when one understands how Jesus is clearly nothing more than a myth in a story book. Just like all the other pre-Christian fairy tales the christ-myth is based upon.
One only need consider Josepheus was born 40 years after Jesus was supposed to have died and there is no other history for him to validate anything he is said to have written about Jesus.
Consequentially itâs more than a little obvious writing attributed to Josepheus is at best merely hearsay and not historical fact. Especially when most of a very small reference about jesus is known to be forgery.
There is no historicity for Jesus.
Remarkable when on thinks the bible jesus is supposed to be the savior of mankind. Yet there is no corresponding formal historical record whatsoever.
Not so surprising when one understands how Jesus is clearly nothing more than a myth in a story book. Just like all the other pre-Christian fairy tales the christ-myth is based upon.
Quote from stu:
There is no historicity for Jesus.
Remarkable when on thinks the bible jesus is supposed to be the savior of mankind. Yet there is no corresponding formal historical record whatsoever.
Not so surprising when one understands how Jesus is clearly nothing more than a myth in a story book. Just like all the other pre-Christian fairy tales the christ-myth is based upon.
We all appreciate your opinion stu.
Thanks for the laugh.