Quote from bigdavediode:
An interesting theory, until one looks at the statistics:
Norway is, if not the richest, one of the richest countries in the world -- with high taxes and lots of socialistic policies.
Sweden has a lower income per capita than the US -- until you accommodate for wealth disparity, then they're richer than the average Joe in the US. Again, high taxes and lots of socialistic policies.
Finland, same.
Ideologies fail.
Quote from FightTheFuture:
Norway again.
Norway's petroleum fund is more than $500 billion or $102,000 per person.
Norway has over expanded its welfare system because of oil, making people dependent, expecting and demanding more forever.
Norway's oil will run out eventually. Guess what will happen.
Quote from bigdavediode:
Yeah, what's the US' petroleum fund at right now? Oh right, nothing. The reasons why Norway has so much money in their fund? One, they don't spend it, and two, they charge oil companies through the nose for royalties.
Has business in Norway been suppressed? Doesn't look like it. Is their quality of life better? Absolutely. Are they, on average, richer? Absolutely.
Plus I gave three examples, Norway, Sweden and Finland. Estonia is another good example -- high socialistic policies (33% payroll deduction for national benefits, plus taxes, plus 20% VAT) and Estonia is doing quite well economically. (Projected 5.9% growth in 2011)
Germany? The economic powerhouse of Europe. 19% VAT, high taxes, lots of socialistic policies, 24 vacation days per year (over four weeks per year) etc. etc. etc.
Ideologies just don't work.
Quote from FightTheFuture:
Your examples are a cute snapshot in the current moment of time.
Optimal government management of the economy is not possible. That is best left to the hundreds of millions of people making their own decisions resulting in trillions of decisions every year, something the government cannot do.
Concentrated central power of socialism eventually leads to democide - death by government.
Democide: 262 million dead, not including wars, in the last century alone. When will the socialists answer for that.
Quote from Martinghoul:
Precisely...
The world is a complex place and the "perfect" solution to all our economic and political issues is a dream. To claim that Ayn Rand had the "right" answer is as silly as saying that the Soviet Union had the answer.
Quote from bigdavediode:
Ah, you don't like taking a "snapshot" at what is happening now? Okay, let's take another moment in time. The US in the past -- see the massive increases and reduction in GDP corresponding to increases and decreases in tax rates? Yeah, I don't either:
Numerous economic crises caused by economists and governments and their awestruck followers want more. They have a lot to answer for.Quote from bigdavediode:
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