Automation: TradeStation or Custom App?

C

crazyveddie

I have a strategy I want to automate. All the back-testing, simluated trading, etc has been done and I have ok performance.

My question: Any thoughts on running a trading strategy (automation) with TradeStation? Stable to trust with real money? Fills ok? Any known weakness/bugs?

Since I strategy is already in TS, I would like to stay on the platform.

Or should I port it to another platform?
 
Dumb question here:

Can you successfully trade a live market by your own hand?

If the answer is no, then you don't have the necessary trading skills to even begin to be able to tell a computer what to do and not do in the markets.

Accomplished discretionary traders can build good autotrading systems because they have the depth of market experience necessary to do it. People who have failed at trading the market by their own hand turn to automated trading systems during times of great desperation. Desperate people fail.

I'm telling you the truth. The rest is up to you.
 
Quote from SteveH:

Can you successfully trade a live market by your own hand?

If the answer is no, then you don't have the necessary trading skills to even begin to be able to tell a computer what to do and not do in the markets.
More...

I disagree. Being able to successfully trade manually is not a prerequisite for being a successful automated trader.

There are huge differences between successful manual and successful automated trading. Manual trading requires systems with a larger edge, as few markets can be watched, and fewer positions can be held simultaneously.

Similarly, manual trading requires trading be focused on larger opportunities (i.e. trades that have an expected profit of, for example, $50 or more). I can't imagine too many manual traders that would carefully watch a market, waiting for the exact perfect moment, then 'pouncing' on a trade and later happy to sell with a profit of $2.00 for the entire trade => simply not worth the effort. But, for an automated trader, a $2 profit multiplied hundreds of times per day, can lead to real money. Plus, for the automated trader, after initial implementation, virtually zero 'effort' is required for each incremental trade, so a trade would be 'worthwhile' even if it yields a profit of only 10 cents for the trade.

I don't want to belabor the point, but IMO successful automated and manual trading are two very different animals. More different than the same, IMO. I don't think one's success or failure in one would necessarily be indicative of their success or failure in the other.

-Eric
 
Eric,

I too agree with you on your thesis and have a discretionary back ground and with a focus on systems and being able to scale to more markets and take the best trades with in your tradeable markets.

But, if does help to have screentime and to understand what the Markets Makers, specialists and the traders whom you compete against are doing to maximize your potential on that systems side and have some aspect of Money Mangement and bet size with some idea of "edge" and a statistical advantage.

I could not pretend to be a system developer with out many years of screentime. you just have to put your time in or let the market take its tuition over time with the mistakes most of us make.

The initial question on this tread is basic. TS is ok for longer-non frequent trading and getting introduced but you will soon find better platforms and tools to backtest with ticks and run more complex multi time frames and other views of price action is other platform like Neoticker, Quant Developer, or custom config.

Get clean data and than build from there.
 
Go to college to become a Doctor, read a book how to do heart surgery, etc. OK, now are you good to go?

trading "AUTOMATED" is no different.

Gee, this is so easy to make money, just automate and make hundreds of trades a day for a few $$ each.

Come on..........GET REAL
 
Although it sort of undermines the whole purpose of automated trading, I'd recommend something in-between automated trading and manual trading such as an automated system with manual confirmation for each individual trade that adds a position or otherwise increases your exposure (not sure if you're trading options, futures, or what).

Richard
 
Quote from crazyveddie:

I have a strategy I want to automate. All the back-testing, simluated trading, etc has been done and I have ok performance.

My question: Any thoughts on running a trading strategy (automation) with TradeStation? Stable to trust with real money? Fills ok? Any known weakness/bugs?

Since I strategy is already in TS, I would like to stay on the platform.

Or should I port it to another platform?
More...

You have to check with TS and read TS's disclaimer carefully to see whether they could provide a stable/streaming execution on live market.



Quote from EricP:

I disagree. Being able to successfully trade manually is not a prerequisite for being a successful automated trader.

There are huge differences between successful manual and successful automated trading. Manual trading requires systems with a larger edge, as few markets can be watched, and fewer positions can be held simultaneously.

Similarly, manual trading requires trading be focused on larger opportunities (i.e. trades that have an expected profit of, for example, $50 or more). I can't imagine too many manual traders that would carefully watch a market, waiting for the exact perfect moment, then 'pouncing' on a trade and later happy to sell with a profit of $2.00 for the entire trade => simply not worth the effort. But, for an automated trader, a $2 profit multiplied hundreds of times per day, can lead to real money. Plus, for the automated trader, after initial implementation, virtually zero 'effort' is required for each incremental trade, so a trade would be 'worthwhile' even if it yields a profit of only 10 cents for the trade.

I don't want to belabor the point, but IMO successful automated and manual trading are two very different animals. More different than the same, IMO. I don't think one's success or failure in one would necessarily be indicative of their success or failure in the other.

-Eric
More...
fully agree Eric.
 
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