attack religion without fear

Quote from seneca_roman:

If Elohim is uses as you say, why does Gen say:

1:26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image"

us seems to indicate more than one god.

Seneca
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Why didn't you also quote the very next sentence in Genesis (1:27) "And God created man in His image He created him..."?

If you were looking to become educated why didn't you ask it as a question of how to resolve the apparent contradiction between the two verses, one after the other? (The answer BTW is that God consulted with the angels to avoid provoking jealousy among them, and to teach humility)

I was not planning to participate in this thread anymore because it's a waste of time trying to convince a person that's wearing tainted glasses that he's not seeing the reality.
However, when you quote things out of context and mislead people that prompted a response.
 
Quote from Option Trader:

Why didn't you also quote the very next sentence in Genesis (1:27) "And God created man in His image He created him..."?

If you were looking to become educated why didn't you ask it as a question of how to resolve the apparent contradiction between the two verses, one after the other? (The answer BTW is that God consulted with the angels to avoid provoking jealousy among them, and to teach humility)

I was not planning to participate in this thread anymore because it's a waste of time trying to convince a person that's wearing tainted glasses that he's not seeing the reality.
However, when you quote things out of context and mislead people that prompted a response.
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"Educated?" Did you happen to read what you just wrote: "God consulted with the angels to avoid provoking jealousy..."

If we were discussing anything other than religion, and someone had written that statement to you, you would have probably called the men in the white coats.

You cannot, as a thinking, intelligent adult, actually believe that God holds court somewhere "out there," and discusses the matters of earth and humanity with a bunch of winged spirits who wear various raiment of amour.

That is a fairy tale for children's bedtimes.
 
Interesting that you rely upon the Jewish people to interpret the Torah into english, but don't rely upon the Jewish people to explain what the Torah means. From Mount Sinai till today, that is our faith; you ask any observant Jew who learns a bit of Torah around the world and he will give you the same answer, from the generation at the time of Mount Sinai, throughout the long exile in all parts of the world, through today.
 
Quote from Option Trader:

Interesting that you rely upon the Jewish people to interpret the Torah into english, but don't rely upon the Jewish people to explain what the Torah means. From Mount Sinai till today, that is our faith; you ask any observant Jew who learns a bit of Torah around the world and he will give you the same answer, from the generation at the time of Mount Sinai, throughout the long exile in all parts of the world, through today.
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christians dont trust jews to be the final authority. after all christians believe that jews are going to hell because through their interpretation of the bible they deny that jesus was the messiah.
 
Quote from Option Trader:

Interesting that you rely upon the Jewish people to interpret the Torah into english, but don't rely upon the Jewish people to explain what the Torah means. From Mount Sinai till today, that is our faith; you ask any observant Jew who learns a bit of Torah around the world and he will give you the same answer, from the generation at the time of Mount Sinai, throughout the long exile in all parts of the world, through today.
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You are welcome to your belief. But, your reasoning mind should suggest to you that the interpretation is not to be taken as a literal statement of fact.

It certainly could be fact, of course. But, so could Peter Pan and Never Never Land. And, that is not a deliberate insult. It's simply a fact of the "natural universe," that proof of religious belief is impossible to accomplish. You either believe it or you don't.

So, go ahead and believe it if you choose. I don't necessarily disbelieve it, myself. But, when I read it, I must stop myself and say, "Come on now, this is not what really took place. It's intended as a glorious story of the beauty and majesty of nature -- not as the screenplay for a Disney flick."
 
Quote from vhehn:

christians dont trust jews to be the final authority. after all christians believe that jews are going to hell because through their interpretation of the bible they deny that jesus was the messiah.
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Well, it's not my responsibility to fix that situation. The main difference is the Jesus issue, which they view changed afterwards, and we view that God would have to take us all back to Mount Sinai again to uproot the original Mount Sinai experience. Leaving out the Messiah issue* and things which the Christians believe changed, it wuold surprise me if Christians don't rely on the Jewish people for interpretation of the doctrine that the Christians themselves acknowledge was given to the Jews at Mount Sinai.


*we also believe in a Mashiach coming, only he's not a Godly figure.
 
John Dough,
I would like to respond, but know we would go on for ever, and am definitely not trying to convert anyone.

If there was one thing a Jew, based on our faith, could recommend to a non-Jew, is to look into the "Seven Laws of Noah". We have 613 laws, and hold that a non-Jew could get eternal life with keeping those laws, on the premise that the Torah given by God to the Jews at Mount Sinai is the "book of instruction" (definition of Torah) for mankind.
 
Quote from Option Trader:

John Dough,
I would like to respond, but know we would go on for ever, and am definitely not trying to convert anyone.

If there was one thing a Jew, based on our faith, could recommend to a non-Jew, is to look into the "Seven Laws of Noah". We have 613 laws, and hold that a non-Jew could get eternal life with keeping those laws, on the premise that the Torah given by God to the Jews at Mount Sinai is the "book of instruction" (definition of Torah) for mankind.
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Fair enough. I will bow out.
 
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Quote from jem:

for the record -- I have to ask the question where do you get the believe me without evidence or burn rhetoric from Jesus?
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point 1. most christians believe in a place called hell where unbelievers will be tortured by burning for eternity for their unbelief.

point 2. since there is no evidence outside the bible that jesue even existed let alone was devine(although most skeptics will concede that a jewish man named jesus probably once lived and was killed by the romans)it would in effect be "believe me without evidence or burn".



some fancy footwork there.

the point being you did find the quotes in the bible from Jesus as you implied?
 
Quote from jem:

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Quote from jem:

for the record -- I have to ask the question where do you get the believe me without evidence or burn rhetoric from Jesus?
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point 1. most christians believe in a place called hell where unbelievers will be tortured by burning for eternity for their unbelief.

point 2. since there is no evidence outside the bible that jesue even existed let alone was devine(although most skeptics will concede that a jewish man named jesus probably once lived and was killed by the romans)it would in effect be "believe me without evidence or burn".



some fancy footwork there.

the point being you did find the quotes in the bible from Jesus as you implied?
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jesus didnt write the bible. who knows what he would have said. i am only going by what all of the great christian sages tell me that jesus ment to say.
 
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