As Paul Tudor Jones Says...

I think that is totally true. People older, wiser, and wealthier have said (with a straight face, while I'm struggling like mad), "Making money is easy. It will come. Don't worry about it."

Literally I have been told that: "Making money is easy."

And it sounds... insulting? When you can't seem to do it.

I think it's true though. ANYONE can make money. Put 100 monkeys at terminals and some would be profitable.

The trick is making AND not losing.

Sounds ridiculous. If you've been doing this for awhile and look back at a month and see how you made 300-500 on several days but gee if you could just cut out that ONE -700 day what a big difference it would make on your month.

How disappointing is it to put in a day's work and effort and end the day with $0?

Pretty disappointing.

Well when you look back at your statement and see that down day and imagine how nice it would be if it were $0, keep that in mind the next time you're having a slow day and are all pissed that day is a $0.

$0 isn't bad.
 
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Ferdiand,

Very insightful post.
Your experience is adding to what Warren Buffet said
no 1: do not lose money,
no 2: do not lose money
no 3: see no 1

And yes indeed, one big aspect of trading is risk management
 
I think this is a great topic. I have traded professionally for years and I can't complain, I have managed to make a half decent living doing what I love. But my priority has always been limiting losses, ive gone on 40 day winning runs and not had a down month in about 5 years. However, am I the biggest trader in my company? Not by a long long way. The guys that make the big bucks almost have no fear.

If I see a trade that puts me in a position where a black swan event (although unlikely) could costs me my month I don't take it. But the big traders take them, they know they will win more often that they lose and when the blow out comes they take it on the chin, have a couple of weeks trading on smaller size then start smashing it again. I could never do that. I guess thats why i'll never be a 6 figure a month trader
 
smallStops said:
Ferdiand,

Very insightful post.
Your experience is adding to what Warren Buffet said
no 1: do not lose money,
no 2: do not lose money
no 3: see no 1

And yes indeed, one big aspect of trading is risk management
More...
%%%%%%%
Great WB quote; he doesnt like debt either. But i found PTJ- Jack Schwager interview much more helpful than WB ''buy + hold forever''LOL Sure ;long term trends are friends but not friends forever
 
tommo said:
I think this is a great topic. I have traded professionally for years and I can't complain, I have managed to make a half decent living doing what I love. But my priority has always been limiting losses, ive gone on 40 day winning runs and not had a down month in about 5 years. However, am I the biggest trader in my company? Not by a long long way. The guys that make the big bucks almost have no fear.

If I see a trade that puts me in a position where a black swan event (although unlikely) could costs me my month I don't take it. But the big traders take them, they know they will win more often that they lose and when the blow out comes they take it on the chin, have a couple of weeks trading on smaller size then start smashing it again. I could never do that. I guess thats why i'll never be a 6 figure a month trader
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Good stuff Tommo. I'm much the same, including the tiering with regards those others who either have less fear or have internalized the bankruptcy externality whereby if they lose they simply walk away and change jobs rather than paying back the losses.
 
Good stuff Tommo. I'm much the same, including the tiering with regards those others who either have less fear or have internalized the bankruptcy externality whereby if they lose they simply walk away and change jobs rather than paying back the losses.
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Hey,

yeah thats right, some people take crazy risks, break every rule in the book and still come out making huge money. I don't know how they sleep at night. Id be lying if I said I didn't get a little jealous sometimes when the guy next to me has averaged his backside off and made 4000 off the bounce back. Whereas as I bailed for a -500 loss. I can't complain, I make money but there are very few rules in trading that can't be bent.

For any beginner out there my best piece of advice (other than be patient with the learning process) is don't be afraid to challenge conventional wisdom
 
Once, I worked with a guy who had (at that time) the largest loss ever for a commodities trader, $75 million (SARS, Jet Fuel, for those in the business, you who know who I am talking about). Nobody in our MO/BO got a bonus that year, since he sank the entire desk. But the trader still got a bonus. When I asked the MD why, he said if the trader didn't get a bonus no other trader would come work for us. So it can be very galling. And the incompetent trader went on to start a large fund and become a hundred-millionaire, only to sink that fund, of course. Some people fall upwards.
 
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Once, I worked with a guy who had (at that time) the largest loss ever for a commodities trader, $45 million (SARS, Jet Fuel, for those in the business, you who know who I am talking about). Nobody in our MO/BO got a bonus that year, since he sank the entire desk. But the trader still got a bonus. When I asked the MD why, he said if the trader didn't get a bonus no other trader would come work for us. So it can be very galling. And the incompetent trader went on to start a large fund and become a hundred-millionaire, only to sink that fund, of course. Some people fall upwards.
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Very true. I'm a prop trader so don't have to worry about bonuses as such as its clear what percentage I get of my profits. But there was one time a guy got caught in a fast move and was collected on a load of orders. He was printing down a couple of million and the market went into auction. When the market came out of auction it opened way higher and the trader made about 200k on the trade. A few people obviously were excited and couldnt wait to go and swap war stories. But the rest of the people that had money in their trading accounts went and drew down to the minimum account balance. We knew if that market hadn't bounced back the company could be out of business and probably all the traders money gone with it.
 
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