Are there any firms that DON'T charge their traders $1,000 per training session?

Quote from Newatthis:

One of the paid advertisers said you get what you pay for. Just because you pay a fee does not mean you get value nor does getting something for free mean you got nothing of value. Often, the cost is not measured in dollars.

I was trained in this business for "free". I went through a major firm's training program. I put up no cash to trade and I paid nothing for the training. I exchanged my time and effort for their knowledge and risk. The firm believed in their training enough to take my risk. I was not responsible for my losses in their training program. I only got 50% of my profits initiially (changed to 75% later) but I had no risk other than time and effort. They believed enough in their training to not charge and to take my risk after training me. Paying $1000 for training then the firm makes me put up my cash and takes no risk is nuts. I would rather get 50% knowing the firm is taking 100% of losses than pay $1000 and know the firm believes in its training so much I take 100% of the losses.

If the training was so good, put your money where your mouth is so to speak.
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I would have to agree. I know there must be firms out there that have spent millions on trader training programs. I would expect such firms to have sufficient faith in their programs to go so far as pay their traders a salary as they go through the training program (i.e. forget about capital contribution....they'll pay YOU). I currently know of only three firms out there that do this: FNYS, D.E. Shaw, and GHCO. Anyone know any others?

thanks
 
Quote from OxonianTrader:



I would have to agree. I know there must be firms out there that have spent millions on trader training programs. I would expect such firms to have sufficient faith in their programs to go so far as pay their traders a salary as they go through the training program (i.e. forget about capital contribution....they'll pay YOU). I currently know of only three firms out there that do this: FNYS, D.E. Shaw, and GHCO. Anyone know any others?

thanks
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....I'd say Susquehanna has an very well respected training program, but good luck getting in their...same with FNYS (I have a friend their in their training program), try living on $30K in New YorK and he has to get coffee and lick the boot's of his trainer every day.....

Training is an element that can, in some instance occur in an office/trading room environment ** if ** you have traders that are willing to share that information with a newer trader. I know the office I trade in, one trader in particular took me under his wing and has shared and showed me some excellent idea's and techniques that have turned my trading around, he is now doing that with another young trader, he enjoy's passing along his knowledge, he is a rare individual and I am greatful......our firm also is "developing" a training center in our Las Vegas office and in our Aliso Viejo office, but I still do not think we have what I think some on this thread want ......finding an individual who is 1) capable of training others and 2) willing to do that is very hard to do....also you are trying to teach people who by their NATURE are individualistic. Having said that we do offer mentoring for traders who trade in our Las Vegas office and I mean one on one training for free. We are trying to bring that same concept to Aliso Viejo, CA office as well.

rttrader
 
When you look for a training program, look for a trainer who is willing to answer questions and more importantly, can ask YOU the right questions. A trainer who tells you what to do is worthless. He must lead you along the path of self-discovery.

The guy who trained me at ETG in Northbrook had 6 of us in a class. He was willing to answer questions and ask them until we gave up. But always after the close. One of the class always had an excuse why he had to leave to get somewhere. That guy never made it past 6 months. The trainer stopped answering his questions because of his work ethic. If the trainer is putting in the time, you the trainee should also be willing.

My point is that learning to trade comes from within. It comes from wanting it. It comes from have a good guide. It is not about how much they are going to pay you during the training or what your payout will be or commission rates, etc. It is about doing whatever it takes to make it and then in the future maximizing your profits through lower costs and higher payouts. Too often a trainee is too focused on the here and now not the bigger long term picture.
 
Q: Are there any firms that DON'T charge their traders $1,000 per training session?

A: Yes, only the firms that have a vested interest in your success. Shops that derive 100% of their revenues from desk fees, commissions and training will charge you per session. Firms that receive a portion of your trading profits and charge higher commissions will usually offer free training. This is the trade-off for newbies.
 
You can simply be an employee of a firm that trades their own capital. There are other models of compensation and training than those previously mentioned in this thread.

Bottom Line: If you are being hired as an employee then the firm should train you, develop you, and compensate you well enough that staying with the firm is a good long term option.

A lot of these models dont treat you like a real employee - even in the cases where you are supposedly "hired" as an employee of the firm. If a stated "employee" deal dosn't feel like there is anything in it other than a paycheck and indefinite slave labor conditions then steer clear.

... At least firms like Bright are upfront about what they provide: They offer an opportunity to start your own business and be an entrepreneur and they dont pretend to be hiring you as an employee.
 
That's what I have always done by forming engineers I recruted in IT. And that's what I will do for traders. Unhappily you can't do that with anybody. That's why I always make a selection on auto-learning capability: I give the guy the minimum principles and I observe him during weeks if not months. I say thing only once. If he doesn't understand I won't repeat, I will wait another context to tell him again. The guy will feel dumb but one day he will be fed up to feel dumb and will force himself to really understand and practice by himself. I never force because I don't want a machine working for me, I want someone that can adapt intelligently by himself without me being after him all the time.

I have observed that these kind of people even when if they know nothing but still have a good background do badly at the beginning but will do better than someone who thinks he knows already and will make less effort to improve and adapt himself. Nevertheless in trading, I don't think that I will take the risk to pick someone that really knows nothing about trading as I was doing for IT not because it would be more difficult but because it would be more costful.

Quote from Newatthis:

A trainer who tells you what to do is worthless. He must lead you along the path of self-discovery.
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I agree on the type of person to look for. As someone once said, "It's what I learned after 'I knew it all' that made me a success."
 
charing traders for training is idiotic - that is a major red flag.

The only place that can charge for training is an actual college or training center that ONLY trains. PERIOD. But in that case - u're getting the theories not the practicalities.

You need to find a firm that is confident enough in itself that it trains u for free, and risks ITS OWN capital.

Otherwise - its just another broker disguised as a firm.

Firms should PROTECT their training by not allowing their traders to share information about it (same as Richard Dennis's Turtles).
 
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