Anyone not making 200k a year from trading is a piker
- Thread starter gmst
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from http://www.word-detective.com/112700.html#piker
Dear Word Detective:
Having returned from a fishing trip where pike were not our sought-after fish, I wondered where the phrase "He is a real piker" came from. Any clues? -- Robert Levine, Old Greenwich, CT.
I'll give it a shot, but there doesn't seem to be a definitive answer to your question. The basic sense of "pike" as a noun is "something sharply pointed," especially a staff with a pointed end. The "pike" fish is so named because it possesses a long, pointed beak.
Untangling the history of "piker" takes a bit of doing. According to the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), a "piker" is "A cautious or timid gambler who makes only small bets; a person who takes no chances; a �poor sport� ... a shirker." A "piker," in short, is no fun at all.
There are a number of theories about the origin of "piker." The OED traces the word to the antiquated verb "to pike," meaning "to leave," which would certainly fit in with the sense of "cautious or timid." Originally, "to pike oneself" meant to obtain a pike or walking stick in preparation for leaving. "To pike" in this sense first appeared around 1420, and by 1889 "to pike" was being used in America to mean "to hold back or back out" in gambling.
Another possibility is that "piker" is rooted in the old British slang term "piker" meaning "tramp," from vagrants who traveled the "turnpikes," or toll roads. (The "pike" in "turnpike" was the barrier at toll booths which was "turned" to allow passage after payment of the toll.)
And yet another possibility, mentioned by Hugh Rawson in his book "Wicked Words," is that "piker" arose on the U.S. West Coast during the 1800s as a derogatory term for someone from Pike County, Missouri. Rawson points to "Okie," used in the 1930s as a derogatory term for migrants from Oklahoma, as a parallel to this possible origin of "piker."
If I had to pick one of the above theories, I'd go with the first, since "piker" in its modern sense seems to fit so well with the original "getting ready to leave" connotation.
Dear Word Detective:
Having returned from a fishing trip where pike were not our sought-after fish, I wondered where the phrase "He is a real piker" came from. Any clues? -- Robert Levine, Old Greenwich, CT.
I'll give it a shot, but there doesn't seem to be a definitive answer to your question. The basic sense of "pike" as a noun is "something sharply pointed," especially a staff with a pointed end. The "pike" fish is so named because it possesses a long, pointed beak.
Untangling the history of "piker" takes a bit of doing. According to the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), a "piker" is "A cautious or timid gambler who makes only small bets; a person who takes no chances; a �poor sport� ... a shirker." A "piker," in short, is no fun at all.
There are a number of theories about the origin of "piker." The OED traces the word to the antiquated verb "to pike," meaning "to leave," which would certainly fit in with the sense of "cautious or timid." Originally, "to pike oneself" meant to obtain a pike or walking stick in preparation for leaving. "To pike" in this sense first appeared around 1420, and by 1889 "to pike" was being used in America to mean "to hold back or back out" in gambling.
Another possibility is that "piker" is rooted in the old British slang term "piker" meaning "tramp," from vagrants who traveled the "turnpikes," or toll roads. (The "pike" in "turnpike" was the barrier at toll booths which was "turned" to allow passage after payment of the toll.)
And yet another possibility, mentioned by Hugh Rawson in his book "Wicked Words," is that "piker" arose on the U.S. West Coast during the 1800s as a derogatory term for someone from Pike County, Missouri. Rawson points to "Okie," used in the 1930s as a derogatory term for migrants from Oklahoma, as a parallel to this possible origin of "piker."
If I had to pick one of the above theories, I'd go with the first, since "piker" in its modern sense seems to fit so well with the original "getting ready to leave" connotation.
from dictionary.reference.com
piker  
pik·er [pahy-ker] Show IPA
noun Informal.
1.
a person who does anything in a contemptibly small or cheap way.
2.
a stingy, tight-fisted person; tightwad.
3.
a person who gambles, speculates, etc., in a small, cautious way.
Origin:
1275â1325; Middle English: petty thief, equivalent to pik ( en ) to pick1 + -er1 ; compare dial. (N England, Scots, Hiberno-English ) pike to pick1
Synonyms
2. cheapskate, penny pincher, skinflint.
piker  
pik·er [pahy-ker] Show IPA
noun Informal.
1.
a person who does anything in a contemptibly small or cheap way.
2.
a stingy, tight-fisted person; tightwad.
3.
a person who gambles, speculates, etc., in a small, cautious way.
Origin:
1275â1325; Middle English: petty thief, equivalent to pik ( en ) to pick1 + -er1 ; compare dial. (N England, Scots, Hiberno-English ) pike to pick1
Synonyms
2. cheapskate, penny pincher, skinflint.
Oh boy, this thread is the king of arbitrary statements, like 200K a year or 3x the average alternative jobs. Who the fuck comes up with these numbers anyway?
By the way being a piker is more a state of mind then a certain amount of profits...
Why not? If I have been trading for 5 years and it costed me 100K, that is exactly the same cost and time what a college student has invested in his future. Time will tell which one of us is going to be more successful. Just like his degree is not a guarantee of employment and success, my 5 years of trading experience also not guarantee of future earnings...
So stop throwing silly words around without clear definitions, and don't make up arbitrary numbers either.
By the way being a piker is more a state of mind then a certain amount of profits...
Why not? If I have been trading for 5 years and it costed me 100K, that is exactly the same cost and time what a college student has invested in his future. Time will tell which one of us is going to be more successful. Just like his degree is not a guarantee of employment and success, my 5 years of trading experience also not guarantee of future earnings...
So stop throwing silly words around without clear definitions, and don't make up arbitrary numbers either.
My wording was misleading. Technical analysis of price action allows one to develop a business plan for trading with positive expectancy, which is what an edge is.
The only way price action stops occurring is if the markets cease to exist.
The way price action is an edge for small retail pikers like me despite the fact that everyone sees the same thing, is that the big institutional traders (fund managers, investment bank traders, hedge fund speculators, hedgers, etc.) have to move sizable positions around and they leave really big footprints, footprints that all of us pikers can see, but that only a tiny handful can trade, because most pikers trade what they think not what they see.
Being a Piker is precisely why people hide their positions in public forums.
Even if you were right on direction, you would get mocked due to piker reasons, it is an environment where it is tough to please.
Even if you were right on direction, you would get mocked due to piker reasons, it is an environment where it is tough to please.
These numbers are very useful. Just like RSI 30 and RSI 70 and a 200day MA have value, just like Gross Profit, Sales, Net Profits have value in accounting, just as your salary, your bonus, your retirement benefits have value, these numbers also have value in career planning and career risk management of an independent trader. If you feel 2x is a better measure feel free to substitute.
HUGE Difference!
Huge difference my friend. A college degree will get you a job. However, 5 years and a failed trading career will make getting a job harder, your girlfriend will ditch you and your social life would be miserable.
Quote from gmst:
why bet when I can tell you if you ask politely
I made 6.5k in June and it was a high volla month. You can extrapolate for the year. Have been at this game for 4 years now. Last year was first time breakeven, before that was losing. Have made money 5 months out of 6 this year from Jan to June. Just thought will do a poll asking career guys on their experience and opinion. Why get so negative?
so you're a piker?
Probably you are the 4th person to ask me this question lol.
Please read the posts above I have already answered.What is funny is that this thread has become more about "Piker", "Pikerness", "Pikerboy", "Pikergirl" etc. rather than about debating about a good level of trading income. Anyways, I am enjoying the debate!
