anyone else notice this bullshit?

Quote from mcelitetrader:

Play the range....

As was said earlier......Go with what is happening.....if the range is 15 cents then take the middle 10 cents and make it yours....

When you see the offer flip to the bid....hammer into a long and put out your offer 10 cents right away......and vice versa.

If they jump and try to push the stock the other way before the price has the chance to hit your exit then hammer yourself out for the few pennies profit....

I was watching GFI for the last few days and saw the spike chart. I have been trading GFI this way....Some joker is piling 50k bid then up 15 cents....then he flips and it comes back down....this happens in light trading.

They can never get away with this on liquid stocks as 50k will be a minor stumble and the big fish becomes a guppy. Take advantage when you see these situations and be quick on the keys. Hope that helps.
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That's basically how I trade. *Except putting out limit orders*

Do you know how to find stocks with the widest range on a 1 minute timeframe, I created a thread in the resources forum if anyone has any information.

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=74730

My trades rarely last longer than 1 minute.
 
not sure if this is automated or what cause there have been a couple times last week when, I was able to hit the bid for 20k shares, it seems like they were to late to cancel their bid and then I saw them cross down four or five pennies in order to get out of the position and then they seemed to be done playing that game for the day. if it was a black box would it not keep placing the fake orders eventhough it took at hit, and how was I able to hit the order for most of its shares, yeah its bullshit but if you know whats going on and they are fake why no just trade them it seems to be easy money (if there is such a thing) for the most part.
 
Quote from Steve Tvardek:

You know whats fucked up though, I noticed a pattern the other day and there was about 10k of offers lined up and I knew they were gonna be pulled so before it looked like the bids would gun for the fake offers, I sent a 3K buy market order. the fucker (WHR) holds my order and lets all the "offers" get pulled so i wouldnt get filled so i had to cancel my order. even when you try to take advantage sometimes, you cant win. needless to say the stock shot up .25 cents with all kinds of bids so it would have easily been like a $500-$700 trade for a mins worth of work :)
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dont get me wrong,, your no doubt a more experienced trader than myself,, ayways as for the market order sent out you no doubt got screwed,, but this is an electronic market,, there are delays,, in orders and information,, i think the second you sent that order,, the trader with the walls knew the momentum was changing and pulled,,, imo,
 
Quote from Steve Tvardek:

You know whats fucked up though, I noticed a pattern the other day and there was about 10k of offers lined up and I knew they were gonna be pulled so before it looked like the bids would gun for the fake offers, I sent a 3K buy market order. the fucker (WHR) holds my order and lets all the "offers" get pulled so i wouldnt get filled so i had to cancel my order. even when you try to take advantage sometimes, you cant win. needless to say the stock shot up .25 cents with all kinds of bids so it would have easily been like a $500-$700 trade for a mins worth of work :)
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This is the best argument for the NYSE going completely electronic ala Nasdaq. On Nasdaq you see the shares, hit the key and they're in your blotter. You don't get fu**ed around by some 70 year old 'specialist' who sits there scratching his balls for 30 seconds then decides to bend you over.

I see this set up sometimes on Nasdaq. Some dip shit who is short like 3k will be trying to work a stock down with bullshit size
of 8k on the next level. Occasionally I will 'reach around' and clean out his bull shit offer, and now you have a genuine panicer/buyer whom you can sell your newly purchased shares to at a handsome profit in mere seconds.

There will always be bullshit and manipulation in the market. The trick is, was and will always be to take what they give you and use it to your advantage.
 
You gotta love catching someone with their hand in the cookie jar :)


Quote from Red_Ink_inc:

This is the best argument for the NYSE going completely electronic ala Nasdaq. On Nasdaq you see the shares, hit the key and they're in your blotter. You don't get fu**ed around by some 70 year old 'specialist' who sits there scratching his balls for 30 seconds then decides to bend you over.

I see this set up sometimes on Nasdaq. Some dip shit who is short like 3k will be trying to work a stock down with bullshit size
of 8k on the next level. Occasionally I will 'reach around' and clean out his bull shit offer, and now you have a genuine panicer/buyer whom you can sell your newly purchased shares to at a handsome profit in mere seconds.
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imopinion when there is a pause on an order,, only to see the stock shoot away,, it is the specialists trick knowing that if he waits up to the 30 seconds he has legally to wait, any bids that are there thinking the stock is going up will start pulling due to uncertainty,, and any short offers the same. as for nasdaq,,no doubt,, im looking into trading that soon,, but the lse getting paid in pounds is tempting me more,ive been dabbling, not much bs there either...
 
i was watching a stock one day (i think it was ACI - it was a coal stock) and it had huge ask... and everytie a little fish stepped in front of him to sell, it got hit immediately and the big ask dropped. then the bids dropped down farther and a seller stepped in front of the big seller by a couple pennies and BOOM!, he gets hit... then the big seller moves down.... but then, after awhile the big seller pulls and all the bids start jumping over each other to get filled, and after a spike, the big seller comes back and it goes back down just as fast, but continues farther down. then the selling continues.... this was a couple days before the stock went on a tear to the upside. if the ADV is pretty thin, they can really do some damage and shake alot of people out before teh real move.
 
keep in mind that some ppl have direct data feeds and most probably have secondary feeds or if you trade retail, maybe your data comes over the internet. this can easily result in delayed quotes of 3 or 4 seconds (or more).

so you might think that you are trying to clean out the bullshitter by throwing in market orders but in reality, the bullshitter already yanked 3 or 4 seconds ago. so just cuz u cant hit the bullshitter's bid/offers doesnt mean the speciailst isnt honoring your orders. if u are sure someone is going to yank, take a position against them and hit the ECNs to make sure you get a fill instead of going market and trying to save a penny or two.

or maybe the bullshitter is a floor trader standing next to the specialist and the second he sees a market order pop in on the specialists screen, he cancels his bogus bids/offers before the specialist matches it up.

and if you dont like the fake bid/offers sort of games, dont trade until mid-september cuz when volume is thin, it is alot easier to manipulate the market.
 
Quote from monistat7:

keep in mind that some ppl have direct data feeds and most probably have secondary feeds or if you trade retail, maybe your data comes over the internet. this can easily result in delayed quotes of 3 or 4 seconds (or more).

so you might think that you are trying to clean out the bullshitter by throwing in market orders but in reality, the bullshitter already yanked 3 or 4 seconds ago. so just cuz u cant hit the bullshitter's bid/offers doesnt mean the speciailst isnt honoring your orders. if u are sure someone is going to yank, take a position against them and hit the ECNs to make sure you get a fill instead of going market and trying to save a penny or two.

or maybe the bullshitter is a floor trader standing next to the specialist and the second he sees a market order pop in on the specialists screen, he cancels his bogus bids/offers before the specialist matches it up.

and if you dont like the fake bid/offers sort of games, dont trade until mid-september cuz when volume is thin, it is alot easier to manipulate the market.
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How does one gain the privledge of trading on the floor on the NYSE?

Also, once specialists go away (if they do), will there still be floor traders?
 
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