Anybody making any real $$$???

Originally posted by goldenarm
I'm only trading Nasdaq stocks via Level 2. I've never tried options, futures or listed stocks and I only dabble in the QQQs through Island and Instinet. When I say that the market is not trending and has no follow through, I mean the Nasdaq. Am I the only one who's noticed that it's stuck in a range? In the last several months, the index hasn't really been going anywhere. Stocks have no follow-through (relative to past years). In other words, they don't go up points, they go up dimes (if you're lucky).
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Try trading listed stocks. Our traders have been doing well for over a decade, and we rarely bother with the Nasdaq. Not a big deal, it's just that the reliable, profitable strategies cannot be employed on the Naz.

The QQQ's are tough unless you have a reliable "goto" basket of stocks for hedging/forecasting purposes.

The market is guarnteed to go UP and Down daily, you need to be able to play both sides with equal ability and tools. The silly naz bubble when everyone could shoot a fish in a barrel was just a flash in the pan....I think you'll like this a lot more if you widedn your horizons a bit!!

Good Luck!!

Don
 
Don, I guess I'm afraid of becoming a newbie again. I've become quite adept at reading momentum on Level 2, although decimalization and the bear market really screwed us Nasdaq jocks over.

It's true that listed stocks don't have as much noise and have clearer moves, but I feel at a disadvantage not knowing the underlying bids and overlying offers. I like to see supporting bids in case I need to blow out of a tanking position. Listed stocks are a different species altogether. Since the specialist holds all of the cards, you have to trade more on fundamentals and charts, not momentum. Also, you don't have to be as precise with your entry and exit points like when you scalp Nasdaq stocks.

Maybe I should give it a shot! Heck, if many of your listed stock traders have six figure incomes in today's market, then I'm wasting my time on the Nasdaq!
 
You'll find the "easy" strategies work well with listed (openings, MOC, etc.). then you can actually "read the tape" take part in "trade throughs" with the Specialist...and all the fun stuff.

The idea is to make money, do you really care which market you're in?

Don
 
Hey Nwbprop, do you have any connections with big broker/dealers in New York City? I would LOVE to get into institutional trading but I lack the Ivy League credentials. I could always go back into daytrading when the market gets better. At least with institutional trading, I have the advantage of knowing the order flow. Compared to directional daytrading, that's like stealing candy from a baby!
 
Originally posted by goldenarm
When I say that the market is not trending and has no follow through, I mean the Nasdaq. Am I the only one who's noticed that it's stuck in a range? In the last several months, the index hasn't really been going anywhere. Stocks have no follow-through (relative to past years). In other words, they don't go up points, they go up dimes (if you're lucky).
More...

I am sorry goldenarm but what more do you want???
The market is anything but stuck in a range!

I am sorry but I am sooooo tired of hearing people complain about this market... This market is as good as any other...

Jun 2001 to Sept 2001 / 2070 to 1088 about 50% down
Sept 2001 to Dec 2001 / 1088 to 1735 about 60% up
Dec 2001 to now / 1735 to 1200 %???

How much volatility is needed???

And as for the dimes and pts... They are no longer trading for $200 a share... So instead of risking 1pt to make 3pts you risk .20 to make .60 and take bigger size its all relative...



PEACE
 
goldenarm-I have a bunch of friends who are ibankers for these institutions. they really cant help anyone get into another sector of their firm because they are considered the bottom of the totem pole. Sux to be a first year analyst. In this job market any job is good....a lot of my fellow ivy league friends do not have jobs. So if you have a job, consider yourself lucky.


jc
 
Thank you for finally putting it in perspective. This is a good trading market. The markets of the late 90's are once in a lifetime markets. This is the type of market traders have made money in for 100's of years. An real trader will be profitable in this market. The wannabe's need to go back to working the drivein window at White Castle.
 
Originally posted by Commisso


I am sorry goldenarm but what more do you want???
The market is anything but stuck in a range!

I am sorry but I am sooooo tired of hearing people complain about this market... This market is as good as any other...

Jun 2001 to Sept 2001 / 2070 to 1088 about 50% down
Sept 2001 to Dec 2001 / 1088 to 1735 about 60% up
Dec 2001 to now / 1735 to 1200 %???

How much volatility is needed???


PEACE
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Well, if I kept positions for three months at a time I would agree with you completely! The problem is that I don't keep overnight positions. I like to have a good night's sleep! However, when the Nasdaq is up 20, down 10, flat, up 5, etc. from day to day, there isn't enough movement for me to do well. I don't dare take size in this market because the risk/reward ratio is no longer 2:1 or better, it's more like 1:1 which is just gambling. Taking size in this market is a shooter's mentality. If I want to make 5K one day, drop 6K, make 10K and be flat on a zillion tickets per day then I'll take size. The only one who'll make money is the prop firm. Otherwise, I'm gonna pick my spots carefully for small size.
 
It happens to the best traders, you simply seem to be locked in a place (mentally) that will be hard to break out of. You have seen some pretty good and honest responses form others who seem to be doing well, and I suggested a new and different approach. Sometimes it just takes time to sort yourself out, and get back in the game. Good Luck !!

Don
 
Goldenarm,i still see plenty of volatility everyday on the nasdaq...look at stocks like qlgc,nvda,and klac,just to name a few...all have 2 or 3 point ranges a day,if not more.
 
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