Anti-War Protestors -- A Serious Discussion

The country goes to war sending young men and women off to fight and die for reasons that many people don't accept and you and Mondo want to hang the treason charge on them. Based on the latest polls by Harris (?) 72% of Americans support the war. 4% are unsure. 24% are opposed. Thats almost 75 million Americans against the war. Out of these 75,000,000, probably about 500,000 are participating in public demonstrations.

Why is it that those beating thier breast proclaiming patriotism want to squelch legal public dissent and sow discord and rancor among us? Aphie, you have resorted to old McCarthyite tactics. Now the protestors are aiding the terrorists. Perhaps you think its an orchestrated tactic by Iraqi agents. Are we so vulnerable as a country and you so weak an individual that an opposing viewpoint on Iraq forces you to seek the nightmare scenario to rationalize your disgust of the protestors?

When did the protestors say don't defend the country? Is it not possible that a reasonable person can conclude that our defense can be better served without armed conflict at this point with Iraq?

When people protested the A-bomb in the early 50s, they were branded communist sympathyzers. Aggressive Vietnam War protestors were profiled and harrassed by the FBI, most often illegally. Regretably, there's always a new generation that is ignorant of the excesses of the past.

Ultra liberal? Try this on for size: www.amconmag.com/10_21/iraq.html

Disclosure: I despise the brutal tyrants of the Middle Easts and the Islamic extremists. I support what I beleive are the administration's farther goals in the invasion ( democratic change in the Mioddle East and a beachhead there to destroy Islamic fundamental terrorism) and I hope the coalition tears up the Baaths and all thier supporters in record time with fewer American and Brit casualties than can seem possible.

I support and encourage all Americans to voice thier opinions pro or con on the fundamental decisions of the Government (Democracy, recuerde?) and I think only limp dick wimps can't handle hearing those opinions that differ from thier own.
 
Quote from Babak:

True Story:

Walking down the street when a guy came up to us and asked us to join a protest 'against the war with Afghanistan'. My brother looked puzzled and asked him, don't you mean Iraq?

The guy looked confused and said, Iraq Afghanistan, who cares! War is bad'

(I swear this is true) :eek:
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It's a pitty ! Invading countries every other month, would lead us all one day to forget which one is being attacked now. By the way, isn't the war on Afganistan still going on ? What's the big deal ?
 
People have a right to their opinion. The anti-war protesters, as much as I disagree with their philosophy, have every right to assemble and voice their dissent.

Having said that, I wonder if the protesters realize that their actions embolden Iraq and our other enemies. Saddam himself has talked this past week about the American public being against the war. An America divided and displayed to the world gives incentives to Saddam and those like him to extend the fighting as best they can in the hopes that we will withdraw our forces as we did in Vietnam and Somalia.

The end result of a protracted war is more casualties, and on both sides.

So one can make the argument that protesting leads, by extension, to a more drawn-out conflict and thus more American deaths.

What good will the protesting do? Will it lead to our forces leaving Iraq?!? Only the most foolish protester believes his or her actions will cause Bush to do a 180 and bail out of Iraq. The majority of the protesters do it because they're angry, by God, and they disagree with Bush and his cabinet, and this is America, so they have the right to say how they feel, and say it they will.
It's the American way.

Fine, but I hear most of the protesters say they are against the war, but for our troops. If they really do support the troops, the thing they should be asking themselves is if expressing their discontent is worth the lost lives that come as a result.

I feel the protesters should let their frustrations be known when it really counts - at the voting booth. Taking action in a manner that will cause some or even many of our troops to lose their lives is an odd way to show empathy for their situation.

P.S. Let me make it clear that I am NOT saying dissent should be silenced and carte blanche be accorded to our elected officials! But I do feel that wartime, with the lives of our troops at stake, is a unique situation, one in which restraint may be the wiser and more noble course of action rather than exercising the right to do otherwise.
 
Quote from dgabriel:

Based on the latest polls by Harris (?) 72% of Americans support the war. 4% are unsure. 24% are opposed. Thats almost 75 million Americans against the war. Out of these 75,000,000, probably about 500,000 are participating in public demonstrations.

Why is it that those beating thier breast proclaiming patriotism want to squelch legal public dissent and sow discord and rancor among us? Aphie, you have resorted to old McCarthyite tactics. Now the protestors are aiding the terrorists. Perhaps you think its an orchestrated tactic by Iraqi agents. Are we so vulnerable as a country and you so weak an individual that an opposing viewpoint on Iraq forces you to seek the nightmare scenario to rationalize your disgust of the protestors?

When did the protestors say don't defend the country? Is it not possible that a reasonable person can conclude that our defense can be better served without armed conflict at this point with Iraq?

When people protested the A-bomb in the early 50s, they were branded communist sympathyzers. Aggressive Vietnam War protestors were profiled and harrassed by the FBI, most often illegally. Regretably, there's always a new generation that is ignorant of the excesses of the past.

Disclosure: I despise the brutal tyrants of the Middle Easts and the Islamic extremists. I support what I beleive are the administration's farther goals in the invasion ( democratic change in the Mioddle East and a beachhead there to destroy Islamic fundamental terrorism) and I hope the coalition tears up the Baaths and all thier supporters in record time with fewer American and Brit casualties than can seem possible.

I support and encourage all Americans to voice thier opinions pro or con on the fundamental decisions of the Government (Democracy, recuerde?) and I think only limp dick wimps can't handle hearing those opinions that differ from thier own.
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Hmm, let's see if I can get this correct. 75,000,000 in opposition, 237,500,000 in favor. If I subtract out about 4% (12,500,000) who are unsure, that whittles the number down to approximately 225,000,000. So I would ask you, what if the 225,000,000 decide that they don't want to hear the noise? What if we voice our support, go about our day-to-day duties, and simply:

a) not aggressively participate in any demonstrations or rallies
b) not seek out participation in any of the daily generated media phone surveys or specially worded opinion polls to restate/reinforce a position
c) quietly allow dissenters to state their opinions in their protests as it really has no real effect other than to let us know that they are not happy, and,
d) quietly pray (for some) that this all can be executed in a swift a manor as humanly possible and have a minimal amount of kills on either side.

This is war! The impatience of the pundits seeing the opposition continue to fight back is as astounding as the act itself. Did not the study of slavery in this country teach you nothing? Somehow I can't fathom you expecting slaves to SUCCESSFULLY revolt against the masters they were imprisoned to. Or even worse, to stand in court in opposition to the laws that made it legal to kill them for failure to understand their servitude. Have you forgotten how MY race was set free?

It was not through a petition or a march. It was a long, painful, death-filled civil war. And I continue to ask, where were France, Germany, Russia, the Arab countries? They were powers of the day, could they not have done more than discuss the plight over tea, caviar and loaves of bread? Many a slave would have welcomed some illegal world intervention by any (or all) who were truly concerned.

You see those things (protest marches, rallies, sit-ins) work into the formula of remedies later when the perpetrator follows a fair and just rule of law. Generally, it's only after the act of wrongdoing has forced someone who has been comforted with the position of status quo, to fear that they may not see the light of another day. And the executioner charged with the task, is aggressively knocking at their door and asking the question, "DO YOU FEEL LUCKY?" Remember, this still can all end quickly. It only takes one guy recognizing that he has become the answer to the phrase, "Who da' man?" :)
 
I definitely think people have the right to assemble and protest. It's the blocking streets and bridges, attacking police, and other illegal activities that bug me. In other words, trying to force their opinions upon others.
 
How about a vote of the American people as to whether they want the police and others to be forced to deal with the protestors or spend their time focusing on terror and crime prevention? It seems to me that without police restraint the protestors might do as much damage as some terrorist attacks.
 
KNOCK OUT IRAQI TV FOR CRYING OUT LOUD........This is the biggest propaganda machine and 100's of times worse than any rally in any city......KNOCK THE FUCKER OUT....:mad:
 
Quote from Doubter:

How about a vote of the American people as to whether they want the police and others to be forced to deal with the protestors or spend their time focusing on terror and crime prevention? It seems to me that without police restraint the protestors might do as much damage as some terrorist attacks.
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What, the American police can't "walk and chew gum"? :)
 
You have freedom of speech

you don't have the right to block streets

you don't have the right to get arrested. You can do it of course, but it just makes you a petty criminal.

You don't have the right to insult soldiers and their families, and if you do it in public I hope you get the shit kicked out of you.
 
Quote from Doubter:

How about a vote of the American people as to whether they want the police and others to be forced to deal with the protestors or spend their time focusing on terror and crime prevention? It seems to me that without police restraint the protestors might do as much damage as some terrorist attacks.
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Pure sophistry.

By that method you would have to eliminate all activities that require police presence. St. Patricks Day parade in NY had more police detailed to it than any protest in the nation. Now its banned because 600,000 Irish revelers put the nation at risk.

The police have many responsibilities. What makes you and Aphie think that those who are detailed to anti terror were pulled off and assigned to anti war rallies? Because if you say so you can tar the protestors with the anti American brush.

 
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