Almost everything works...

danielc1 · Apr 28, 2012

I find something amusing, but I'm also puzzled about it... Most things on this site is about how nothing works and that the majority of people lose their money in trading. I have seen many, many methods of trading. You know what I find out? Most of the stuff out there that is public knowledge works very well. Darvas, Gann, Krauz, Kase, Curtis, Cooper, Tharp, Douglas, Elder and so on, have shared some ideas that work.

I think that the reason why the majority of people lose their money in trading has nothing to do with trading but in why they trade. Maybe people trade to lose and not to win money. Winning money does not solve internal struggles, losing does... because it requires change. Change of words, change of thinking, change of feelings, change of being...

So it is not the method of trading that people see or use that causes losing, it is the people their innerselfs, that is causing this...

I'm wondering who share this believe on this site. Then I can put everybody else on 'ignore'

EON Kid · Apr 28, 2012

Quote from danielc1:

Most of the stuff out there that is public knowledge works very well.

you have been registered for 10 years and you make a comment like this.
People lose on both mentioned & more reasons. Please put me on ignore, carry on in your ignorant bliss

danielc1 · Apr 28, 2012

Quote from EON Kid:

you have been registered for 10 years and you make a comment like this.
People lose on both mentioned & more reasons. Please put me on ignore, carry on in your ignorant bliss

There is a buddhims saying: Threath people as of they are more enlighted than you, only then you can learn from others. Please share your innerthoughts why you think that the statement is not correct.

I'm glad I made you laugh, carry on...

keeptradin' · Apr 28, 2012

Quote from danielc1:

There is a buddhims saying: Threath people as of they are more enlighted than you, only then you can learn from others.

Another good Buddhist saying is that "All unhappiness comes from attachment", or something along those lines. I find that to be true in trading, for when I become attached to the outcome of a trade, it causes me to act on emotion, rather what I see in the market.

My best trades are the ones that I enter at the price given by my setup, set my target and stop loss, then walk away. My worst trades are when I stare at the screen, move my orders, average in to a loser, etc.

I too find that most methods will work well some of the time if the trade is managed properly. Finding one that works well most of the time is the tricky part, as is developing the confidence to execute according to one's trading plan.

Handle123 · Apr 28, 2012

We live in a microwave world, we expect it yesterday. Too many simple don't take the time to learn, they believe read a few books, backtest a couple weeks, open an account and they are prepared to compete with those who have struggled through all the up and downs, and become very good at trading. Trading is a grind, those who have been at this a long time know to accumulate wealth, is making small consistent profitable trades overall. The homerun trades people hear every five years hardly ever arrive for the trader who makes a living at this. I have been fortunite to make some very huge trades, but nobody wants to hear it took 25 or 30 tries to find the top/bottom.

99% of what I do is either backtesting or waiting, and 1% is trading. Not very exciting, but that is how it is done. If someone can't wait, they will lose, if they don't study, they will lose, if they don't backtest, they will lose.

Having good entries is nice, but what happens after you are in the trade is the most important.

Rabbitone · Apr 28, 2012

There is no âPuzzleâ as to why so many traders wash out. It was the same reason I washed out twice in the middle 1990âs â greed and ego. I thought I had the brains to beat Wall Streetâs best in on any day using my âtestedâ day trading method. It cost me a pretty penny to find out I was wrong. I almost did not come back to trading. But passion over came my anxiety to try a 3rd time.

The 3rd time I tried a new tact in trading after using a big yearend bonus to fund an account. I decided to use a different method with 4 key tenets:
- Trade from daily and weekly charts, only.
- Trade in the direction of the markets.
- Trade swings and positions only.
- Limit losses to fixed percentage of my account.

Is it dull and boring trading? Yes.

Did the trading plan get more complicated than the 4 tenets? Yes?

Does it work once the bugs are worked out? Depends?

Is it profitable? If you trade swings and positions over the long term, yes. But a drawdown that last several months can be very discouraging.

Did it work for me? Yes, once I understood when I could and could not do my trading it worked. Iâm now am retired.

The bottom line is some of things those authors present work only for their trading plan. What you discover is their general ideas are not âcookie cutterâ. Trying to duplicate trades with their trading style and your trading restrictions undermines you. You have to build trades what work only for you and your style of trading. Taking an authors trade that is not âyoursâ destroys your trading plan.

danielc1 · Apr 28, 2012

I'm glad that there is some agreement with the findings allthough that the people post above have a point that it is the exits and the whole understanding of what has been said and done that makes a trading method work and not just the plain text you read in the books...

EON Kid · Apr 28, 2012

Quote from danielc1:

There is a buddhims saying: Threath people as of they are more enlighted than you, only then you can learn from others. Please share your innerthoughts why you think that the statement is not correct.

I'm glad I made you laugh, carry on...

search your inner thoughts as to why 95% cannot be right or win.

It never troubles the wolf how many the sheep may be.
Virgil, Aeneid

Lights · Apr 28, 2012

Quote from danielc1:

I find something amusing, but I'm also puzzled about it... Most things on this site is about how nothing works and that the majority of people lose their money in trading. I have seen many, many methods of trading. You know what I find out? Most of the stuff out there that is public knowledge works very well. Darvas, Gann, Krauz, Kase, Curtis, Cooper, Tharp, Douglas, Elder and so on, have shared some ideas that work.

I think that the reason why the majority of people lose their money in trading has nothing to do with trading but in why they trade. Maybe people trade to lose and not to win money. Winning money does not solve internal struggles, losing does... because it requires change. Change of words, change of thinking, change of feelings, change of being...

So it is not the method of trading that people see or use that causes losing, it is the people their innerselfs, that is causing this...

I'm wondering who share this believe on this site. Then I can put everybody else on 'ignore'

Most people who follow these systems fail because none of them talk about risk management

blowingup2012 · Apr 28, 2012

Actually the method put out by Buffet and Rogers works very very very well. Basically, you wait...sit on your hands...until the opportunity is obvious. Then you move in like a shark. You hold out...hold out once more sitting on your hands until the time there is a lot of enthusiasm and you dump your shares into the enthusiasm.

When is that time to jump in and trade? For myself, that time would be when this chart gets down much much lower.

Right now, there seems to be a lot of enthusiasm in the market and its a horrible time to invest. The time to invest is when its much much lower. If you follow my sage advice, then you will make a little money or maybe even a lot of money. Just wait for this chart to come in which may take several months to over a year, but it will come in. When it does come in, do your homework first on whatever you trade or invest in. Morningstar.com has independent analysts and their subscription service is cheap for what you get. Dont invest in crap because crap can trade sideways or go bankrupt...witness American Airlines.

There are a few on the internet who claim they can trade everyday no matter the market conditions, but claims made over the internet and real brokerage/bank statements reviewed in-person are two different things. This is fantasyland where anyone can log in and tell you they made a boatload on some trade the other day. The truth is if you were to visit these people you wont find any Ferraris in the driveway and the honest plumber down the street seems to live a better lifestyle then them. Trust no one.

My greatest mistake over the last 10 years was not trusting this one chart. So right now, this chart tells me to go away or just watch and wait. This will find another reason to come down, just a matter of time.