Alexis Tsipras' "open letter" to German citizens

[i am nobody]

Greece's GDP growth was no worse or better than countries like France, Denmark, etc.

Life went on in Greece as it did for millennia, and the Greeks were happy about it.

No better cheaters than the Greeks. It is not because they say deficit was 3% that it so in reality. Now it is clear that 3% was in reality almost 15%. Europe checked it but too late. And Greek politicians admitted they lied massively.

If they live like that already for millenia, how does it come that in 2011 they suddenly run out of money? They needed more than 200 milliard euro. They could not live anymore like before and they were not happy anymore. Masks fell of.

 

[Tsing Tao]

No better cheaters than the Greeks. It is not because they say deficit was 3% that it so in reality. Now it is clear that 3% was in reality almost 15%. Europe checked it but too late. And Greek politicians admitted they lied massively.

If they live like that already for millenia, how does it come that in 2011 they suddenly run out of money? They needed more than 200 milliard euro. They could not live anymore like before and they were not happy anymore. Masks fell of.

Greek politicians lied, yes. So did the bankers that confirmed the numbers (I think it was Goldman Sachs), but the EU Presidency knew about it, as well. You seem to have some prejudice and personal dislike of Greeks. I've got news for you, the French, Spanish, Portuguese, Polish, etc...all just as corrupt. Let's not even talk about your home country of Cambodia (assuming your profile is correctly posted).

Shall we list which countries are not at 3% deficit right now in the EU?

Of the 25 or so countries with the biggest shadow economies, Greece isn't even listed.

http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/10/07/0729_worlds_biggest_shadow_economy/

 

[d08]

You seem to have some prejudice and personal dislike of Greeks. I've got news for you, the French, Spanish, Portuguese, Polish, etc...all just as corrupt. Let's not even talk about your home country of Cambodia (assuming your profile is correctly posted).

This serves as anecdotal evidence but I've been all over Europe and the only place I've been blatantly cheated on was in Greece, in a supermarket of all places. I don't think all Greeks are dishonest but there seems to be a higher concentration of dishonest people over there. Let's just leave it at that.

 

[Visaria]

Hot Greek girls, mmmmmm!!!!

 

[Tsing Tao]

This serves as anecdotal evidence but I've been all over Europe and the only place I've been blatantly cheated on was in Greece, in a supermarket of all places. I don't think all Greeks are dishonest but there seems to be a higher concentration of dishonest people over there. Let's just leave it at that.

Have you been to Russia?

 

[samuel11]

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/27/books/boomerang-by-michael-lewis-review.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Interesting book. Tends to support what “i am nobody” says.

 

[i am nobody]

Greek politicians lied, yes. So did the bankers that confirmed the numbers (I think it was Goldman Sachs), but the EU Presidency knew about it, as well. You seem to have some prejudice and personal dislike of Greeks. I've got news for you, the French, Spanish, Portuguese, Polish, etc...all just as corrupt. Let's not even talk about your home country of Cambodia (assuming your profile is correctly posted).

Shall we list which countries are not at 3% deficit right now in the EU?

Of the 25 or so countries with the biggest shadow economies, Greece isn't even listed.

http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/10/07/0729_worlds_biggest_shadow_economy/

Greece is the only country in Europe that costed us so much money and where you can find these things:

• Nobody pays in metro in Athene. They should but there is no control. But this is not important because Europe paid the whole metro for the Olympic Games 2004.

• For more than 600 profession general rule is retirement at 50. Pension is 95% of last salary.

• On a population of 12 million only 5000 declare to have an income of more than 100.000 euro. But 60.000 Greek families have investment for at least 1 million euro.

• In Kifissia only 300 people declare to have a swimming pool (on which they have to pay taxes). But in reality more than 20.000 swimming pools are located in Kifissia.

• In 2012 1.400 dead people still received pension. Total pension fraud is over 64 million euro.

• Tsochadzopoulos, ex minister for Pasok in Greece, is now in prison for bribery in excess of 160 million euro because Europe insisted on it.

• 121 person were arrested for fiscal fraud because Europe insisted on it. They declared almost no income but they had bank accounts in other countries with amounts between 20 and 50 million euro.

• In 2011 42 milliard euro taxes were not paid by Greek taxpayers.

• On the island Zakynthos 650 inhabitants pretended to be blind and cashed in money. 600 of them were not blind at all.

I was in Russia too. Very corrupt country too. But did not cost over 200 milliard euro to the European taxpayers.

And the deficit from Greece when they applied for membership was not 3% but close to 15%!!! That is a world of difference. Greece should be in the top of the list if you take the REAL deficit and not the deficit the Greeks were talking about.

 

[AdrianHagh81]

well the silver lining in all of this that there will be an influx of immigration of greek olive skinned party girls in most of northern europe and prolly the us too.

anastassia korkoulous yummy.

 

[volpunter]

you are posting nonsense. Nobody lent to Greece with any reasonable knowledge that the loans cannot be repaid. By the way this suggestion itself is nonsense. Of course it is easy to claim that a loan cannot be repaid. But can you please provide factual backup why the loans cannot be repaid? If Greece indeed went through structural reforms, if taxes were actually collected and society be made productive again and if an incentive was created to be productive then the loans can easily be repaid in full. Now, we can argue and talk about a potential delay in repayment but not any haircuts. There is no reason why to grant haircuts to a people are arrogant, who burn national flags of countries that actually saved their ass, and to people who are simply too lazy to make changes in their lives.

I understand the legal aspect about it. But a creditor that lends to someone they know cannot pay back the loan has no one but themselves to blame. I don't know why we argue this anyway.

If I give a $10,000 loan to a homeless beggar who swears that he is going to repay me in a month, it's it purely the beggar's fault when he doesn't?

 

[volpunter]

that is precisely the point. Bravo. I understand that nobody on earth wants to face more realistic economic realities but none of that wishful thinking changes the fact that Greeks have been living way beyond their means and those that paid for them are sick of doing so without seeing anything in return. Simple as that.

Even more ironic is the fact that countries like Estonia participated in the Greek bailout. Poorer and hard-working, bailing out Greeks who just took too many holidays and bought too many Porsches.
Austerity is the only way for Greece, some people will emigrate and many will face hardship but the alternative of other countries keeping Greece afloat isn't a possibility.
Note that many Greeks who were protesting over their salary cuts simply didn't want a more economically realistic lifestyle, it's not like they would've starved with those reduced salaries. It's just the continuation of the "I deserve" mentality.