Accepting new contracts

Seriously - you think highly priced US programmers don't produce bugs? You can develop quality software in India, debug it here and even maintain the code - you'll come out ahead. I know it as much as anyone since I have spent months on "dead" projects
bilking insurance companies out, in one case 50 Mill. The brainchild of the project were some egghead Ph.D.'s in IBM Hawthorn research lab. I have seen waste, mismanagement and general stupidity and malaise in proportions that you have no idea in the US IT industry. No wonder they pulled the plug..
Quote from cashonly:



When your automated app has a bug that causes it to send out 1000 orders in a few seconds, then you watch as your P&L plummets as you frantically try to stop the app and then close all the positions hoping slippage is all you'll lose, you can smile thinking "at least I got a good hourly rate on the program".
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We can point at exceptions to prove anything we want.

My personal experience has been that the US programmers
are far superior to their indian equivalents.

I work with both groups all the time, and the foreign
guys ON AVERAGE are newbies compared to the
US guys.

However.... management cant get their eyes
off the 1/4 pay factor, so it doesnt matter.


peace

axeman



Quote from andrasnm:

Seriously - you think highly priced US programmers don't produce bugs? You can develop quality software in India, debug it here and even maintain the code - you'll come out ahead. I know it as much as anyone since I have spent months on "dead" projects
bilking insurance companies out, in one case 50 Mill. The brainchild of the project were some egghead Ph.D.'s in IBM Hawthorn research lab. I have seen waste, mismanagement and general stupidity and malaise in proportions that you have no idea in the US IT industry. No wonder they pulled the plug..
More...
 
Quote from andrasnm:

Seriously - you think highly priced US programmers don't produce bugs? You can develop quality software in India, debug it here and even maintain the code - you'll come out ahead. I know it as much as anyone since I have spent months on "dead" projects
bilking insurance companies out, in one case 50 Mill. The brainchild of the project were some egghead Ph.D.'s in IBM Hawthorn research lab. I have seen waste, mismanagement and general stupidity and malaise in proportions that you have no idea in the US IT industry. No wonder they pulled the plug..
More...

I didn't say anything about one nationality of programmer being better than others. I have worked with American, Indian, Chinese, and Russian programmers... all of them BRILLIANT. I have also worked with American, Indian, Chinese, and Russian programmers... all of them IDIOTS.

What I am saying is don't just go for the cheap rate without being sure there is quality there as it could cost you. This is particularly true with automated trading applications. Make sure that they HAVE experience in this arena, not GET experience on your nickel.
 
Someone said it right - the poster wanted to offer a service and for all we know he could be wonderful.
I don't like what is going on in terms of globalization etc. There is no protection to US taxpaying worker than the savings on off-shore projects are going to be wasted.
I did not mean to put him down and the only reason I posted my reply because I am in the business as well (I hire programmers). It came across a bit crass and insensitive. I am sorry. We are in the same boat....
2 years ago I was making $90 per hour now I am hiring programmers myself.....
 
Quote from WDGann:

Give him a break...

A program made by a good and experienced programmer that is delivered in 10 days are equivanlent to 100 days of a non-experienced cheap programmer.

Also, all the bugs and fixes will be more frustrating...

Eventually, it's cheaper to go for an experienced but expensive programmer...

This is from a programmer's point... andrasnm... can you even program in C++ or even Java??? or have done some professional programming?

Other than that...

programmer... get a job...
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My rate is a very reasonable $45.00 /hr.

$7-$10/hr?? Are you insane? Someone who charges $10/hr but doesn't know a the difference between a 'market' and 'market at the open' order could not only cost you tens of thousands in revenue from attorney fees, but it can ruin the reputation of your company - and you can't buy that back.

As far as the get a job part, I'm actually pretty busy right now
:D, thank you very much, as I'm sure other people on this forum running a small business can attest to.

My motto is simple: First time, every time, on time. If someone else can deliver that for 7 bucks and hour, I'd like to hire them and give 'em a raise!
 
Quote from ColdLogic:



After speaking with Neal Thomas about a small project, I am confident that "do the same" includes the following:

1) Speak English without aid of an interpreter.
2) Have experience and knowledge of US-based datafeeds.
3) Be available by simply making a continental-US phone call.(essentially free for most of us).
4) Work in a time zone within +/- 3 hours of my own.
5) Be accessible (and accountable) after the job is completed.


Anyone who thinks these are not important practical considerations has never actually managed a programming project.
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There is great variability in the quality of overseas resources for a given rate.

After having managed large projects for fortune 50 comapnies which included systems/subsystems being developed overseas I can tell you that I am well aware of the issues.

Like I said, if you are doing commodity stuff - and trading desk front ends and most server work is commodity - it makes no sense to do all the work in the states when you can reduce costs by going to a reliable overseas contractor.

Our products are not commodity and we dont use overseas resources because we dont need to ..... Its nice to put our own citizens to work and we do so if it makes sense.
 
stock and commodity markets with ~ one billion people.
thinking that NONE of those brown people don't know squat about market orders and can't program with FIX 4.0 protocol is wishful thinking....
ok for fin. dev. work they may charge $15 - it is still more competitive than you may think.
Oh yes some Indian programmers speak the Queens english and I can't say that for lot of the 'locals' in CA who only speak valley talk, man.
 
Thank you Elite - I was very suprised at how much many people are looking for custom trading systems, it was kind of overwhelming. To the people I'm negotiating with now, I will keep commitments and provide work as discussed, but I've accepted what should be a long term contract and won't have any spare time for extra work.

I don't mind competing with the Indians or Pakistanis or Russians... send the best you got. Way I figure it, if I can't dazzle them with brilliance, I'll baffle them with bullshit. Either way, they walk away scratching their heads!
 
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