Abolish the Income Tax: Steve Forbes and Peter Schiff

Quote from dandxg:

I am not going to read this whole thread because it's been covered so many times. Has anyone considered that approx. 70% of the GDP is based on consumer spending? When you go to a consumption tax what do you think is going to immediately happen? Ppl are going to freak out at what things cost. This will cause a short term recession.

When you visit a foreign country you consider your purchases harder when VAT is approx. 19%, roughly double the US sales tax. I am actually for a consumption tax, a flat tax, but don't think the lobbying forces for CPA and tax related ppl. are just going to sit back and support that. There is a lot of money made of the current dysfunctional system.

People don't change until they feel enough pain. It's human nature. There isn't enough pain to motivate change, yet, maybe in a couple of years.

Post Edit: How will do with online sales loopholes? Many skate that tax all the time. Few states are closing it yet.
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While I don't support the consumption tax, your concern regarding higher priced items is slightly irrelevant because every man, woman, and child would receive a monthly prebate in order to help cover living expenses up to the poverty level. Yes, even the wealthy would receive monthly disbursements. Because the embedded income tax would disappear from each good and service, prices wouldn't increase by much.

Unfortunately, it sounds too good to be true. Say you earn $2 million a year. You can live pretty well spending $1 million, and as a result pay a mere 11 percent of that year's income in taxes. If the very rich pay less, that means more of the total tax burden in any year has to fall on somebody else, most likely the middle class. Reasonable people can disagree about whether this really matters -- over time, a consumption tax only appears more progressive because the rich savers or their descendants eventually spend the money and get taxed.
 
Most of those who scream in favor of abolishing income tax want to just play wealthy people protectors.

Most wealthy people understand that their wealth does not come from the skies but from the consuption of middle and lower class poeple. They have no objections to be paying income tax as long as it does not go over a certain level. Most wealthy people also understand that a mere consumption tax is unfair to most people and endagers their futures profit potential.
 
US income tax system is the best tax system in the world

Visit Europe and then a third world country, and you will understand

Best system ever

Some idiots are complaining about tax codes. You can tell they have never used computer and internet for their taxes

The number of idiots in this forum is mind boggling to me.
 
The reason tax will never be 'fair' is one, no one is ever going to pay the same thing because the government are made up of human beings too and are all looking to pay themselves. Two, people are forced to pay taxes, if you refuse to pay taxes you either get fined or go to jail! I'm amazed people can't see the wrongness in this, for some god damn reason we have people growing up thinking that it is the governments god given right to take our money.

I'm not rich and I hate the idea of taxes and I'm actually one poor motherfucker who hasn't even gotten a real income yet and I live in a middle class family. The ironic part of all this chest beating over 'rich' people paying taxes is that it is in fact the middle class who get taxed the most and I think you have to be complete morons to support this kind of system purely for the reason that it doesn't do what people who support it say it is.

It reminds me very much of kings and dictators where they always thought that they had some god-given right to rule the country they were in and lord over people. That isn't the damn case anymore because the government is supposed to be representing the people and all they are representing now is corruption, ignorance and arrogance.
 
U.S. tax code shouldn't be complicated.

10% on net income both personal and corporate, including all capital gains, no more tax shelters
10% sales tax, including food
10% service tax, this includes fees & commisions

$10.00 x (acres - easements) x (number of people per square mile) = property taxes owed per year

No tax credits. No tax returns.
 
Quote from DrPepper:

An American family that earns $373,651 is in the 35% tax bracket and has to pay $130,777.85 in federal income taxes. When you add state tax, property tax, personal property tax, sales tax, capital gains tax, etc., people in the upper tax brackets have to pay over half of their income to the government.

Conversely, a family that earns $68,000 only has to pay 15% in federal income tax or $10,200.

Therefore one family pays $130,000 while another family pays $10,000 to live in the same country, drive on the same roads, be protected by the same police, firemen and military, send their children to the same schools, etc.

In a land where everyone is free to work as smart and as hard as they want to earn money, please explain to me in a rational way how it is fair for different people to be required to pay vastly differing amounts of money for the benefit of living in the same country.
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So do you think a hobo should pay the same annual tax as a billionaire? The latter benefits much more from law & order, security, courts etc, as it is the only thing stopping his wealth from being stolen. The hobo benefits almost zero - no car, no contracts to enforce, no wealth to protect.

IMO a flat % tax is the most fair, not a true flat tax i.e. the same X per annum per person regardless of earnings.
 
Quote from sumfuka:

1. What would be the fair % level for this consumption tax?

2. How would the gov tax corporations like walmart? (outsourced all their stuff to china, say eyeglasses made for 50 cents, sold to the US consumer for 50 dollars; they would get taxed for 50 cents ?? since they consumed the product from china for 50 cents.)

3. How would this consumption tax affect wages, real estate, insurance, blah blah blah, everything that is a tax write-off as of right now?
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You could probably have a flat 15% tax on all incomes, business profits, capital gains, consumption/VAT, and import tariffs. Instead of capricious property taxes, make it a fixed 15% of rentable value (i.e. if it would rent for 1k a month, tax it 150 a month).

Govt spending should be determined by desired tax rates, not the other way round.
 
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