abolish the Federal Reserve?
- Thread starter procrastinator
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It's about more than banks whining (but I'm pretty sure the person losing their house isn't exactly smiling). The Northern Rock situation is a prime example. Nobody wanted to lend them money because nobody knew exactly where they stood liquidity wise. You then have a situation where the trust in the banking sector breaks down because of an information assymetry. Textbook case for goverment intervention.
The question, I guess, is whether or not you let a financial meltdown happen or try to avoid it. There are those who will argue that short term pain will be good in the longer term and I can understand that. But can the BIG bill being paid ie. the destruction of the economy and financial system be a good thing on any time-horizon?
Who needs numbers. Have you been to a store lately or filled your tank. CPI IS a waste of time. Unless your buyinmg computeres evry day like food and energy
"I'm not so sure the Fed has failed. I'd say the number one culprit for the housing bubble and virtually every other bubble is the American public; Joe Sixpack. The Fed's role has effectively become that of a babysitter - protecting the people from themselves."
HO HO - this is rich! Blame the victims. The politicians who have been bought and paid for allow these banks to create these SIV's and disguise the poor quality of bank loans and then when the big banks eat them up out of greed it's "bail us out - OR SUFFER A DEPRESSION SUCKERS! - Oh yeah - we're in banking positions with gobs of money but you, Joe Q Public should have known more than us and not taken the free money you were handed."
"The problem lies with the attitude and mindset of a nation, something that's very hard to change. Things like the Marginal Propensity to Consume, Import and Borrow have got out of control and the Fed only has a very limited influence on these things."
No, the problem lies with credit cards companies (again, the financial institutions) who with the help of their bought-and-paid-for politicians are sending credit card approvals to 6-year-olds and people's pets, let alone your kids just entering college. It's to get them started EARLY with the mindset that living in debt is not just ok - IT'S A LIFESTYLE. And what could be wrong with that lifestyle? Except the financial institutions will enslave you if you miss a payment, ensnaring you into a life of indentured servitude to them (one-step removed of course - don't want to be seen as condoning slavery in these day and times).
"The question, I guess, is whether or not you let a financial meltdown happen or try to avoid it. "
Oooo - you mean "Catch-22 - Suckers?"
Scam -scam, the flim-flam man! Always gets away because he can!!
HO HO - this is rich! Blame the victims. The politicians who have been bought and paid for allow these banks to create these SIV's and disguise the poor quality of bank loans and then when the big banks eat them up out of greed it's "bail us out - OR SUFFER A DEPRESSION SUCKERS! - Oh yeah - we're in banking positions with gobs of money but you, Joe Q Public should have known more than us and not taken the free money you were handed."
"The problem lies with the attitude and mindset of a nation, something that's very hard to change. Things like the Marginal Propensity to Consume, Import and Borrow have got out of control and the Fed only has a very limited influence on these things."
No, the problem lies with credit cards companies (again, the financial institutions) who with the help of their bought-and-paid-for politicians are sending credit card approvals to 6-year-olds and people's pets, let alone your kids just entering college. It's to get them started EARLY with the mindset that living in debt is not just ok - IT'S A LIFESTYLE. And what could be wrong with that lifestyle? Except the financial institutions will enslave you if you miss a payment, ensnaring you into a life of indentured servitude to them (one-step removed of course - don't want to be seen as condoning slavery in these day and times).
"The question, I guess, is whether or not you let a financial meltdown happen or try to avoid it. "
Oooo - you mean "Catch-22 - Suckers?"
Scam -scam, the flim-flam man! Always gets away because he can!!
I watched those videos ... if true not only it doesn't bother me a bit ... but I like what they do ... I don't believe there should be an equal consequence for all actions, but human stupidity and weakness itself is a consequence (either of their own action or their God's) and so humans deserve what they get ... they actually deserve worse ... and if few are smart enough to take advantage of humans, then be it.
looking at what humans are one can easily state that their defense system (physical, mental, ...) is many times weaker than their ability to attack ... i.e a sharp object could easily penetrate the human body, whereby a sharp or semi-sharp object can easily be found in nature and used against any human ... humans have hardly progressed in the path of increasing their defense but have always tried to advance in attacks .... increasing the probability of their death upon any attack carried out on them ... well who does those attack systems belong to ... you guessed right ... so why not use such stupidity against them ... this is one example and yet there are many ...
Why would an individual attack someone weak and stupid? Imo my opinion that makes that individual more of a lowlife than the weak and stupid people...
Who would be impressed with an IFC guy that went into the ring with a 80 year old woman or a 6 year old boy?
I think the problem here is that most of these adults were not weak and stupid- they know it's wrong to go overly in debt and did it anyway.
But there's an irony that most everyone is missing on this thread: it's actually these "weak and stupid" people that are often taking the bank to the cleaners! That's right - I know a guy in San Diego whose wife is one of the most highly sought after people in the US: she's a mortgage "collection" person. She has banks begging her to work 60 hours a week and she came out of "retirement" from raising her child to work again because of it.
Why? Because right now the banks know they can't foreclose without taking a huge loss on subprime properties. This guy's wife's job is to deal with people over 90 days late on their mortgage payment who are subprime and find out "what they can pay" and "work with them".
Basically, these fools and idiots are probably making about 2/3 of their mortgage payment and still keeping their house!! So all of us smart people are paying full mortgages, while they sit back and get a monstrous discount.
It's really the banks and brokerages that are most hurt by this - and all the people with multiple degrees that are the masterminds of their own crisis. I ask who is really weak and stupid?
on a few points your post is flat out opposite to actual reality...and in a most orwellian way.
fact is it's made clear you see nothing wrong with the most pervasive and devious form of usury...what's not clear is the extent of your tolerance. so i am curious to know if you think only the money changers should have carte blanche as own earned right to scam people or do you condone any other form of usury no matter who engages in it?
thx
"If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property, until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power of money should be taken from banks and restored to Congress and the people to whom it belongs. I sincerely believe the banking institutions having the issuing power of money, are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies." ~ Thomas Jefferson
fact is it's made clear you see nothing wrong with the most pervasive and devious form of usury...what's not clear is the extent of your tolerance. so i am curious to know if you think only the money changers should have carte blanche as own earned right to scam people or do you condone any other form of usury no matter who engages in it?
thx
"If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property, until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power of money should be taken from banks and restored to Congress and the people to whom it belongs. I sincerely believe the banking institutions having the issuing power of money, are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies." ~ Thomas Jefferson
1. I don't know what the true inflation rate is. Anecdotally, 8-10+% seems more accurate. Those who track the Fed's "money pump" claim money supply increasing 8-12% average over the last 5 years, with a +14% pace in '07. Excessive money supply and credit creation is the sole source of inflation. Doesn't take a genius to connect these dots.
2. Bigger problems? Oh yes. The Fed and Gummint are two heads of the same serpent.
3. So, you're not an American. That explains your acceptance of the Gummint's brainwashing attempts to get us to behave like the inflation rate is "low, no problem".
The whole world knows GWB's accusation of WMDs in Iraq was one big lie. The "inflation is 2%, so don't worry.. be happy" lie is at least 10 times bigger.
No it is not. While money supply does affect inflation there a ton of other things that are significant, if not more so. Monetarists and Keynesians have different views on this but monetarism has been tried and has failed as I said earlier in this thread.
Go to Wikipedia and look up the terms, cost-push inflation, demand pull inflation and built-in inflation (expectations).
No I am not but I am trying to provide an objective point of view as an outsider, free of the emotion (and passion) which Americans bring to this type of discussion.