“The future solvency of the United States as a nation state is currently in jeopardy.

[aceofbase]

foreign policy after world war 2 was battles in foreign lands.


do you want the battles will be fought in US land

US gov't will have no choice to cut back on the military and welfare. all these unemployment checks extensions are welfare and social security checkss are welfare.

cancel the nasa program. cancel SEC

Quote from Scataphagos:

None of those are a threat to our borders or sovereignty. Just take care of them, if necessary. Seriously... do you think anyone is foolish enough to do a significant attack on the USA? Would be suicide and they know it.

All we NEED to do is defend our borders. And that doesn't necessitate fighting other countries' battles nor having troops in 130 countries around the world.

 

[Mav88]

About 50% of US federal tax dollars go to defense related expenditures.

Misthos, how dumb are you? are you on crack? A simple 2 minute search on the internet and you can get your facts straight.

You need your voting privledges revoked.

 

[vrtrop22]

Mav88, I found 54% went to current defense and former military (i.e retiree benefits) I dont begrudge that I mean they served our country well and proudly. What are you seeing? This was federal income tax btw.

 

[Misthos]

Quote from Mav88:

About 50% of US federal tax dollars go to defense related expenditures.

Misthos, how dumb are you? are you on crack? A simple 2 minute search on the internet and you can get your facts straight.

You need your voting privledges revoked.

Mav88 - I understand your concern, let me address that:

Federal Income tax dollars are just that. Federal. Not Social Security, not Medicare, not unemployment... When a president discusses raising or lowering taxes - what is he referring to? The Fed Income tax - the same tax I refer to in my post.

It's a distinction I am making - I do not lump SS or Medicare because they are separate taxes that are levied for specific purpose(s) - Medicare and SS does not fund the military or government functions, etc (at least not directly). When viewed in that light - then defense spending approaches/surpasses 50% depending on the year.

Am I clear? a lot of people get confused when the military percentage to tax thing is discussed. I am basically not counting ss or medicare because they are actually separate funds earmarked with specific purposes. Your fed tax bracket is a separate thing from SS or medicare. Makes sense?

aceofbase:

As for us getting invaded... there are these things called the atlantic and pacific oceans. We can blow anyone out of the water or air before that could happen. That's why we were pretty much unscathed after WWII.

 

[Misthos]

Quote from vrtrop22:

Mav88, I found 54% went to current defense and former military (i.e retiree benefits) I dont begrudge that I mean they served our country well and proudly. What are you seeing? This was federal income tax btw.

I agree... if anything, I especially believe active military is grossly underpaid. They should not be treated as social workers - but as the professionals they are and paid accordingly.

 

[Mav88]

Mav88 - I understand your concern, let me address that:

Federal Income tax dollars are just that. Federal. Not Social Security, not Medicare, not unemployment... When a president discusses raising or lowering taxes - what is he referring to? The Fed Income tax - the same tax I refer to in my post.

It's a distinction I am making - I do not lump SS or Medicare because they are separate taxes that are levied for specific purpose(s) - Medicare and SS does not fund the military or government functions, etc (at least not directly). When viewed in that light - then defense spending approaches/surpasses 50% depending on the year.

Am I clear? a lot of people get confused when the military percentage to tax thing is discussed. I am basically not counting ss or medicare because they are actually separate funds earmarked with specific purposes. Your fed tax bracket is a separate thing from SS or medicare. Makes sense?

but what's the point? in the end it's all money that has to be paid and taxed. Artifical accounting exercises will not help us from the massive overhang of medical expenses and the taxes that will be needed to pay for them.

wanting to save on military is fine, but it won't save us.

 

[fhl]

Quote from Misthos:

About 50% of US federal tax dollars go to defense related expenditures. 50%!! And we spend more on defense than all G20 countries combined!

Now, why do we do that? For the reason that Eisenhower laid out in his farewell address. Eisenhower really wanted to call it a "Congressional Military Industrial Complex" but he didn't want to piss off the Congress. Congress is important as they hold the purse strings. Esienhower, a former general, saw the system of retired generals working for defense contractors with congressional connections firsthand. He guessed (rightly) where it would lead.

I will acknowledge that the defense budget indeed supports many middle class americans that work for defense contractors. I know many people in that industry. We like to say that we have a capitalist system - but let's look at reality - we spend 50% of our federal tax dollars to support the defense industry - it is a huge taxpayer subsidized industry - more so than any other country in the world.

As for our global military presence - it is not some altruistic purpose of "promoting democracy" or being the world's "policemen."

It is to maintain free markets for our goods and services, to maintain the flow of money, and to preserve our access to natural resources. It truly is or maybe was in our best interest.

However... this military presence used to serve the average american well between 1946-1970s when our economy was the world's lender and producer. With de-industrialization and outsourcing - that is no longer the case. The people that benefit the most now are the elites. And they call the shots.

The elites use words like "world's police," "indespensable nation" and "promote democracy" to give a loftier goal to our true ambitions. After all, if the elites were honest with the population about our global adventures - then soldiers would feel ripped off or worse, used. Imagine if we said we liberated Iraq for their OIL -if you were a soldier facing bankruptcy because you served abroad with a lower wage - and you also saw the former Exxon Mobile CEO and Chairman retire with 100s of millions of dollars - wouldn't you feel pissed off? Don't you deserve some of that windfall for putting your life on the line?

That's why we "liberate" countries.... to make sure there is no moral argument for the little people to have access to the spoils of war.

In ancient times warfare was more entrepeneurial. You fought, you looted, you kept a chunk of the loot - and went home the equivalent of a millionare. Not today. Today you fight for "ideals" and get paid accordingly - like a social worker.

Holy cow, you just can't get off of this neocon/exxon executives claptrap that bill moyers and the far, far, far, far, far, far left have spewed out for the last eight years.

Have you ever read the constitution?
There is <i>very little the Fed Gov't should be spending <b>any</b> money on other than defense</i>.

 

[Scataphagos]

Quote from fhl:

Holy cow, you just can't get off of this neocon/exxon executives claptrap that bill moyers and the far, far, far, far, far, far left have spewed out for the last eight years.

Have you ever read the constitution?
There is <i>very little the Fed Gov't should be spending <b>any</b> money on other than defense</i>.

In a recent interview when asked how he would cut back on the federal deficit, Ron Paul said, "I'd start with eliminating spending not authorized by The Constitution".

That makes him a "right-wing whack job", right?

 

[eusdaiki]

The status quo of the US $ as a world reserve and trade currency is being question all over the place... Even MercoSur going to stop using USD's in international transactions and stop using the USD as reference price for their currencies...
With the USD not being the currency of world trade, there will be decreasing interest for purchasing of dollars by foreign countries (it probably won't dry to 0 or anything, but demand will likely go down)
Add that to the fact that at the pace The treasury is headed they'll soon land themselves a solid AA rating (or worse...)
Another point of concern is the levels of liquidity being held by banks (as pointed out by the Mises institute in this articles:
http://mises.org/story/3522
http://mises.org/story/3525

Once the damn breaks and all the liquidity gets lent to the public... things might get ugly...

 

[Mav88]

Have you ever read the constitution?
There is very little the Fed Gov't should be spending any money on other than defense.

I agree 200%. The very idea that the government should provide medical care is strange in some ways, but many decades of liberal rhetoric has transformed us into a selfish herd of children. Many believe they have a right to whatever they want when they want, no matter who it hurts financially. The tipping point is past, current liberals don't give a damn about insolvency and they have enough votes to keep it going- game over.