It is so refreshing to know someone exists that sees in him the same things I do.
A question to people that don't "believe" in TA
- Thread starter tommo
- Start date
It is so refreshing to know someone exists that sees in him the same things I do.
This TA question is like discussing politics and religion. TA brings out the believers and the non believers as well, same as religion brings out those who do and those who do not.
Politics brings out those from both sides as well, most political discussions will narrow down to which party is doing what for the person doing the arguing.
TA is no different, those that use it and make money know how to use it, those that pan TA are lost in the complexity of the game itself.
The discussion will be settled only for each individual in their own way. The complex inputs needed to form an opinion to take a trade (setup, signal, etc) or to pass on the trade comes from nothing short of past experiences and results.
Two fellas on this thread have it right as they stated. the others might get it sooner or later, else they will fade away.
This daytrader profession is as difficult as any profession out there, find what tools work, discard those that have failed. The intuitive brain will guide you.
TA is very difficult, as someone else stated, if it was easy the game would be over. Actually the game gets bigger and bigger. get it right with TA or do as the famous general said. JUST FADE AWAY.......................
Politics brings out those from both sides as well, most political discussions will narrow down to which party is doing what for the person doing the arguing.
TA is no different, those that use it and make money know how to use it, those that pan TA are lost in the complexity of the game itself.
The discussion will be settled only for each individual in their own way. The complex inputs needed to form an opinion to take a trade (setup, signal, etc) or to pass on the trade comes from nothing short of past experiences and results.
Two fellas on this thread have it right as they stated. the others might get it sooner or later, else they will fade away.
This daytrader profession is as difficult as any profession out there, find what tools work, discard those that have failed. The intuitive brain will guide you.
TA is very difficult, as someone else stated, if it was easy the game would be over. Actually the game gets bigger and bigger. get it right with TA or do as the famous general said. JUST FADE AWAY.......................
When I was swing trading equities I used TA....went the usual route starting with a few basic indicators and MAs then added more and pretty soon my screen was way to busy to see what was actually happening. I did this for several years.
For the past 6 weeks I've been day trading ES and have used nothing but price, volume, Market Profile, and Time & Sales on the ES. I do watch TICK, TRIN and ADD to keep an eye on the overall market. To me, price action says it all...everything else is simply a derviative of price/volume/time.
I've been profitable both ways (TA with stocks and no TA with ES) but I actually feel more confident without TA.
Do what works for you....
For the past 6 weeks I've been day trading ES and have used nothing but price, volume, Market Profile, and Time & Sales on the ES. I do watch TICK, TRIN and ADD to keep an eye on the overall market. To me, price action says it all...everything else is simply a derviative of price/volume/time.
I've been profitable both ways (TA with stocks and no TA with ES) but I actually feel more confident without TA.
Do what works for you....
Let's Call The Whole Thing Off!
(Words by Ira Gershwin; music by George Gershwin,
Introduced by Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers in the film "Shall We Dance?")
(Words by Ira Gershwin; music by George Gershwin,
Introduced by Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers in the film "Shall We Dance?")
- Things have come to a pretty pass -
Our romance is growing flat,
For you like this and the other,
While I go for this and that.
Goodness knows what the end will be;
Oh, I don't know where I'm at ....
It remains to see we two will never make one
Something must be done.
You say eether and I say eyether,
You say neether and I say nyther;
Eether, eyether, neether, nyther -
Let's call the whole thing off !
You like potato and I like po-tah-to,
You like tomato and I like to-mah-to;
Potato, po-tah-to, tomato, to-mah-to -
Let's call the whole thing off !
But oh, if we call the whole thing off, then we must part.
And oh, if we ever part, then that might break my heart.
So, if you like pajamas and I like pa-jah-mas,
I'll wear pajamas and give up pa-jah-mas.
For we know we
Need each other, so we
Better call the calling off off.
Let's call the whole thing off !
You say laughter and I say lawfter,
You say after and I say awfter;
Laughter, lawfter, after, awfter -
Let's call the whole thing off !
you like Havana and I like Havahnah
you eat bananas and I eat banahnahs
Havana, Havahnah, Bananas, banahnahs
Let's call the whole thing off !
But oh, if we call the whole thing off, then we must part.
And oh, if we ever part, then that might break my heart.
So, if you like oysters and I like ersters,
I'll take oysters and give up ersters.
For we know we
Need each other, so we
Better call the calling off off.
Let's call the whole thing off !
"For the past 6 weeks I've been day trading ES and have used nothing but price, volume, Market Profile, and Time & Sales on the ES. I do watch TICK, TRIN and ADD to keep an eye on the overall market. To me, price action says it all...everything else is simply a derviative of price/volume/time.
I've been profitable both ways (TA with stocks and no TA with ES) but I actually feel more confident without TA."
hey. that's great. that is pretty similar to how i trade YM
but don't fool yourself. that ***IS*** TA
TA is not just the supercalifragilisticexpialidociousindicator (tm).
it's the study of price and/or volume over time to indicate future direction
i use TICK, TRIN, AD, market profile, tape, and support/resistance (I throw in a bit of fib too occasionally). and pivot levels (not merely floor pivots, but pivots in general.
that's ALL TA.
you can't say i use (TA TA TA TA TA) and say you're more confident without TA.
Market Profile is DEFINITELY TA.
look, TA is the study of price over time and/or volume.
market profile does just that. just in a DIFFERENT way than conventional charts.
again, as another poster stated - many are afraid to admit that THEIR method of TA *is* TA.
dood. it's TA.
I've been profitable both ways (TA with stocks and no TA with ES) but I actually feel more confident without TA."
hey. that's great. that is pretty similar to how i trade YM
but don't fool yourself. that ***IS*** TA
TA is not just the supercalifragilisticexpialidociousindicator (tm).
it's the study of price and/or volume over time to indicate future direction
i use TICK, TRIN, AD, market profile, tape, and support/resistance (I throw in a bit of fib too occasionally). and pivot levels (not merely floor pivots, but pivots in general.
that's ALL TA.
you can't say i use (TA TA TA TA TA) and say you're more confident without TA.
Market Profile is DEFINITELY TA.
look, TA is the study of price over time and/or volume.
market profile does just that. just in a DIFFERENT way than conventional charts.
again, as another poster stated - many are afraid to admit that THEIR method of TA *is* TA.
dood. it's TA.
1979 = edge trading "boxes" and selling conversions. 1985 edge for both gone or minimized. No one would pay what we wanted for them any longer, therefore that market ceased to be viable. Opening only has morphed into need for FV, more stocks, etc., yes it works, but entry/exits are much different than 4 years ago. Program Trading "works" buy only when proper market conditions "allow" it to by having derivatives fluctuate enough to find the 'edge"...
Not disputing, just adding to my interpretation.
All the best,
Don
Of course TA works. Because of human nature.
For instance support and resistance.
Imagine:
stage 1: at 10 many people buy a stock after having been in a trading range between 9 and 10.
stage 2: stock goes up to 12
stage 3: stock goes down to 10.
Many people who saw the stock going up from 10 to 12 will buy because they missed the rally before. Very simple. There are usually buyers right above 10.
If for whatever reason stock goes to let's say 9.50, People who previously bought around 10 will sell because they see the position turned against them and do not want to take a loss. Usually stock will go down more. (so because of underlying conditions -something happened- and because of the people who were wrong before and have to correct this)
However, nowadays people make TA more complex then it is. For me it just means certain pricelevels are important because I think there are many buyers or sellers at those levels. At those levels you can draw lines, support and resistance.
Just the fact that a stock that has been going up for a while is usually going up more proves that TA works.
just my 2 cents
regards,
Ivo
For instance support and resistance.
Imagine:
stage 1: at 10 many people buy a stock after having been in a trading range between 9 and 10.
stage 2: stock goes up to 12
stage 3: stock goes down to 10.
Many people who saw the stock going up from 10 to 12 will buy because they missed the rally before. Very simple. There are usually buyers right above 10.
If for whatever reason stock goes to let's say 9.50, People who previously bought around 10 will sell because they see the position turned against them and do not want to take a loss. Usually stock will go down more. (so because of underlying conditions -something happened- and because of the people who were wrong before and have to correct this)
However, nowadays people make TA more complex then it is. For me it just means certain pricelevels are important because I think there are many buyers or sellers at those levels. At those levels you can draw lines, support and resistance.
Just the fact that a stock that has been going up for a while is usually going up more proves that TA works.
just my 2 cents
regards,
Ivo
Divergences with RSI, which is TA at some of it's finest, are best seen on a line chart, not a bar or candlestick chart. They can be seen on those charts but it is easier on a line chart. To demonstrate this, just look at the hourly GECM6 chart plotted with lines . You'll see that price and RSI have roughly the same pattern until after about 2 PM EST yesterday. Then you will see the indicator known as RSI diverge from the pattern being created by price and foretelling a move upwards. Anti TA folks make the case that everything they need to see , can be seen with price. This is of course, a fallacy as I have just shown. Price is important to be certain, but not incorporating indicators even just one or two, is wrongheadedness at some of it's finest.
Valid point... The "self-fulfilling prophecy" aspect certainly plays a role in TA. If enough people use the pivot points on the S&P daily (as many do), then we see the trading channels working (until they break, of course).
Don