A future business
- Thread starter Troy
- Start date
They
What am I looking for?
1) Successful traders, not necessarily, they might be a help or hindrance. A trader who's been generating good returns may well not be as receptacle to new ideas or changing his views. However the trading that I'm talking about is generally medium/longer term in nature and would work best on a range of markets, so perhaps someone that wants to change their style might be of interest.
Remember what I said, the group that I'd like to put together would all be speaking the same language but with different accents. I feel confident that I've got the tools to teach this language, so I feel that I could take anyone off the street who is organized, motivated and asks questions.
I'm trading small at present. But like I said I can't accomplish what I want on my own. To me a group is far better than an individual.
2) Programmers. No, I'm a big believer of computers for managing data/information but I'm not really into systems or number crunching. I'm not knocking this route though, it's just not my vision.
3) Money (to put it all together). Of course, but not really at present. I have some ideas but this is why I put the post up, to see if anybody wants to discuss these ideas further, add their own ideas and see what develops.
Aaron, also works for 1/4 and 3/4 but I'm sure your smart enough to work this out for yourself
Is the goal of your idea to make money trading financial instruments?
If so, you should think long and hard about discounting any trader who is successfully trading a financial instrument(for those successful traders are not necessarily sitting around watching macd,stochastics etc... - they might be deciphering world events/news and using fundamental behavioral patterns of the market)
Is your goal to be able to decipher world events/news and then trade financial instruments from the knowledge you have gleaned? Well, then welcome to the world of trading. George Soros, Troy. Troy, George Soros.
When you say "View Point" don't you mean Time Frame? Unless you know the time frame that the info you just gleaned will play out on, it wont do you much good. Well, unless you don't plan to trade with your info and you want to start an advisory service.
Not throwing ice water on you. Just helping you to refine your "plan"
You may want to read up on Richard Wyckoff's principles
You can do a search or here are some terms;
http://www.ltg-trading.com/glossary_of_wyckoff_terms.htm
You might want to read up on Market Profile and the concept of Value as well
Wyckoff and Market Profile should give you a good understanding of the "fundamental behavior of the market.
If so, you should think long and hard about discounting any trader who is successfully trading a financial instrument(for those successful traders are not necessarily sitting around watching macd,stochastics etc... - they might be deciphering world events/news and using fundamental behavioral patterns of the market)
Is your goal to be able to decipher world events/news and then trade financial instruments from the knowledge you have gleaned? Well, then welcome to the world of trading. George Soros, Troy. Troy, George Soros.
When you say "View Point" don't you mean Time Frame? Unless you know the time frame that the info you just gleaned will play out on, it wont do you much good. Well, unless you don't plan to trade with your info and you want to start an advisory service.
Not throwing ice water on you. Just helping you to refine your "plan"
You may want to read up on Richard Wyckoff's principles
You can do a search or here are some terms;
http://www.ltg-trading.com/glossary_of_wyckoff_terms.htm
You might want to read up on Market Profile and the concept of Value as well
Wyckoff and Market Profile should give you a good understanding of the "fundamental behavior of the market.
they,
do i KNOW you ?? just curious.....
best,
surf
do i KNOW you ?? just curious.....
best,
surf
cool. stay in the curl, brother.
best,
surf
best,
surf
They
Thanks for your reply, and I wouldn't mind if you were throwing water around.
I understand your point regarding successful traders but I've known many over the years (used to work on an Exchange) and I always felt that they were comfortable in their own abilities and weren't too interested in changing. Or if they did change they changed themselves or naturally with the markets.
However most of these guys were locals and I've never really known many position traders, and this is ultimately my style of trading and what I want to develop more.
But at the end of the day, I talk to anyone.
My goal is not really to decipher world events/news but to get a simple feel for what's happening and see how one can take advantage of it. In my view there's likely to be a lot of turmoil in the years to come (even without Sep 11) and those traders who are active in following world events and piecing together the information should get on better than those that wait for the press to report it.
Take that China information as an example, I now follow all the far eastern indices and local currencies, takes me a few minutes to scan my charts everyday. As I do this I'm building up a price and character history in my head of what's going on, but I'm not looking for anything, no trades no nothing. But one day maybe five years down the road this information will likely come in handy for some reason or another. And if it doesn't then I haven't really wasted much time.
But my concept isn't just about this type of research, I just wanted people to see that this was one area in the overall business.
As for Soros, well not many people can compete with his intellect, and I don't have any aspirations to trade or think like him. Economics is not my bag, never seen too much evidence of it working much for the majority. I read recently that an economist is someone who will tell you smugly exactly why this or that has happened, but can't tell you what is likely to happen in the future. Pretty much sums them up to me.
When I say 'view point' I simply mean 'market structure' and in multiple timeframes. Two or more minds viewing the same problem with the same training are often better than the one.
Nah, not intererested in an advisory service. Anyone with half a brain could set one of these up in a few days, marketing would be the key. My plan would likely take a few years to really get going.
I agree with you on Wyckoff. A trader can learn a lot from his discussions on cause and effect.
Not so sure on MP, I looked at it many years ago and it never really gelled with me. But similar to Wyckoff you can't argue with the research done by Steidlmayer.
Have a good weekend.
Thanks for your reply, and I wouldn't mind if you were throwing water around.
I understand your point regarding successful traders but I've known many over the years (used to work on an Exchange) and I always felt that they were comfortable in their own abilities and weren't too interested in changing. Or if they did change they changed themselves or naturally with the markets.
However most of these guys were locals and I've never really known many position traders, and this is ultimately my style of trading and what I want to develop more.
But at the end of the day, I talk to anyone.
My goal is not really to decipher world events/news but to get a simple feel for what's happening and see how one can take advantage of it. In my view there's likely to be a lot of turmoil in the years to come (even without Sep 11) and those traders who are active in following world events and piecing together the information should get on better than those that wait for the press to report it.
Take that China information as an example, I now follow all the far eastern indices and local currencies, takes me a few minutes to scan my charts everyday. As I do this I'm building up a price and character history in my head of what's going on, but I'm not looking for anything, no trades no nothing. But one day maybe five years down the road this information will likely come in handy for some reason or another. And if it doesn't then I haven't really wasted much time.
But my concept isn't just about this type of research, I just wanted people to see that this was one area in the overall business.
As for Soros, well not many people can compete with his intellect, and I don't have any aspirations to trade or think like him. Economics is not my bag, never seen too much evidence of it working much for the majority. I read recently that an economist is someone who will tell you smugly exactly why this or that has happened, but can't tell you what is likely to happen in the future. Pretty much sums them up to me.
When I say 'view point' I simply mean 'market structure' and in multiple timeframes. Two or more minds viewing the same problem with the same training are often better than the one.
Nah, not intererested in an advisory service. Anyone with half a brain could set one of these up in a few days, marketing would be the key. My plan would likely take a few years to really get going.
I agree with you on Wyckoff. A trader can learn a lot from his discussions on cause and effect.
Not so sure on MP, I looked at it many years ago and it never really gelled with me. But similar to Wyckoff you can't argue with the research done by Steidlmayer.
Have a good weekend.
Troy
Are you trading at present, and if so are you trading the method and ideas that you're talking about?
And if you are trading the ideas and methods that you're talking about, why not continue to do business as you are.
CB
Are you trading at present, and if so are you trading the method and ideas that you're talking about?
And if you are trading the ideas and methods that you're talking about, why not continue to do business as you are.
CB
Yes, I'm trading the ideas, up around 5% since I started a model account back in the middle of Sep.
THe reason why I don't just want to do it on my own is because a group could be so much better in many ways.
In my original post I said that I have the all the necessary tools to train people and put this plan into action. I feel that I could take people in off the street if need be and train them up to be very competent traders.
However in talking with people about ideas such as this, most people want to back the horse that's already leading the race, and I'm only in the stalls at present.
Back in the mid 90's I wanted to manage some accounts for some of my brokerage clients but they weren't interested apart from one guy. So after a year or so of solid returns I went back to all the original clients with the results, now surprise surprise everyone was interested, but instead of me taking a reasonable cut of profits/commissions I charged them a lot. You can't have it both ways, ie bet the winning horse when it's in the lead at the same odds as you'd get for it in the stalls.
So personally this is what I think is going to happen to me over the next few years. I'm going to be trading away, doing my research and hopefully generating some good solid returns. Then human nature being what it is, I'll start getting some calls and enquires from the same people who had the chance to originally get involved.
But business being business, they'll have to pay a lot more. We'll see.
THe reason why I don't just want to do it on my own is because a group could be so much better in many ways.
In my original post I said that I have the all the necessary tools to train people and put this plan into action. I feel that I could take people in off the street if need be and train them up to be very competent traders.
However in talking with people about ideas such as this, most people want to back the horse that's already leading the race, and I'm only in the stalls at present.
Back in the mid 90's I wanted to manage some accounts for some of my brokerage clients but they weren't interested apart from one guy. So after a year or so of solid returns I went back to all the original clients with the results, now surprise surprise everyone was interested, but instead of me taking a reasonable cut of profits/commissions I charged them a lot. You can't have it both ways, ie bet the winning horse when it's in the lead at the same odds as you'd get for it in the stalls.
So personally this is what I think is going to happen to me over the next few years. I'm going to be trading away, doing my research and hopefully generating some good solid returns. Then human nature being what it is, I'll start getting some calls and enquires from the same people who had the chance to originally get involved.
But business being business, they'll have to pay a lot more. We'll see.
Troy,
everything agreed. I like the way you look at the whole thing of trading and investment. In essence it is all about predicting the future. I have some capacity, significant experience in managing money and a small team. Whenever you want to talk about specific projects let me know.
The difficult part is to find out what is predictable and what is not. I personally believe that the whole game is not so much about being right than about placing the bets in correspondence with the odds. Most things in the markets cannot be predicted wiht enough accuracy to justify big bets - thus there have to be many small bets. What do you want to trade?
peace
everything agreed. I like the way you look at the whole thing of trading and investment. In essence it is all about predicting the future. I have some capacity, significant experience in managing money and a small team. Whenever you want to talk about specific projects let me know.
The difficult part is to find out what is predictable and what is not. I personally believe that the whole game is not so much about being right than about placing the bets in correspondence with the odds. Most things in the markets cannot be predicted wiht enough accuracy to justify big bets - thus there have to be many small bets. What do you want to trade?
peace