Since federal pensions come from the general federal budget it makes no sense to talk about them as if they are the same as state and local underfunded pensions. If you don't get the difference it's not really possible to have a meaningful discussion with you about it.
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51st State.
- Thread starter vanzandt
- Start date
The Island of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of poverty and corruption. The Island Government of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of corruption. Nepotism, graft, and an under the table cash economy reigns. Their problems are their own. We can cut them loose and they may become another Haiti. (Their island neighbor to the North.) Alternatively, we can bail them out. There will be pressure on Congress from the hedge funds that bought Puerto Rican debt at distress sale prices. (The Puerto Rican Constitution mandates payment of the debt, but there is no money to pay it without drastic cuts elsewhere.)
We should not bail them out nor allow them Statehood (same thing) short of putting the Island Government in receivership, sending in the marines to maintain order, hordes of attorneys from the DOJ to prosecute, and repealing the Jones Act. Puerto Ricans are statutory citizens of the U.S. That status does not convey all the same rights as native born, or naturalized, U.S. Citizens. Their status can be revoked by Statute. The last thing we want to do is allow them Statehood without correction of the underlying problems that caused the crisis. It would be like adopting Haiti. (The Island of Puerto Rico itself has vast underused natural resources.)
Younger, educated Puerto Ricans are leaving the Island in droves, exacerbating the Island's problems.
We should not bail them out nor allow them Statehood (same thing) short of putting the Island Government in receivership, sending in the marines to maintain order, hordes of attorneys from the DOJ to prosecute, and repealing the Jones Act. Puerto Ricans are statutory citizens of the U.S. That status does not convey all the same rights as native born, or naturalized, U.S. Citizens. Their status can be revoked by Statute. The last thing we want to do is allow them Statehood without correction of the underlying problems that caused the crisis. It would be like adopting Haiti. (The Island of Puerto Rico itself has vast underused natural resources.)
Younger, educated Puerto Ricans are leaving the Island in droves, exacerbating the Island's problems.
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Why is there this pension crisis in the first place?
Do not people put in during their working lives, then this get invested profitably by professionals, then people take out what they put in and the profits??????
One reason is that the used overly optimistic rates of return when they projected the future payments to retirees.
Dominican Republic, literally half of the same island as Haiti (and the half closer to PR, by the way), isn't another Haiti. So it's a little bit of hyperbole to say that PR would become one of the poorest nations in the hemisphere, now isn't it? Also, you might want to brush up on the Posse Comitatus Act, sending in Marines to maintain order has been illegal since 1878. In fact it's one of the things that separate us from the banana republics, ironic you should call to ignore it while warning that PR will become a banana republic! Apart from that, the corruption cleanup definitely needs to be part of any bailout package.The Island of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of poverty and corruption. The Island Government of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of corruption. Nepotism, graft, and an under the table cash economy reigns. Their problems are their own. We can cut them loose and they may become another Haiti. (Their island neighbor to the North.) Alternatively, we can bail them out. There will be pressure on Congress from the hedge funds that bought Puerto Rican debt at distress sale prices. (The Puerto Rican Constitution mandates payment of the debt, but there is no money to pay it without drastic cuts elsewhere.)
We should not bail them out nor allow them Statehood (same thing) short of putting the Island Government in receivership, sending in the marines to maintain order, hordes of attorneys from the DOJ to prosecute, and repealing the Jones Act. Puerto Ricans are statutory citizens of the U.S. That status does not convey all the same rights as native born, or naturalized, U.S. Citizens. Their status can be revoked by Statute. The last thing we want to do is allow them Statehood without correction of the underlying problems that caused the crisis. It would be like adopting Haiti. (The Island of Puerto Rico itself has vast underused natural resources.)
Younger, educated Puerto Ricans are leaving the Island in droves, exacerbating the Island's problems.
The Island of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of poverty and corruption. The Island Government of Puerto Rico is a cesspool of corruption. Nepotism, graft, and an under the table cash economy reigns. Their problems are their own. We can cut them loose and they may become another Haiti. (Their island neighbor to the North.) Alternatively, we can bail them out. There will be pressure on Congress from the hedge funds that bought Puerto Rican debt at distress sale prices. (The Puerto Rican Constitution mandates payment of the debt, but there is no money to pay it without drastic cuts elsewhere.)
We should not bail them out nor allow them Statehood (same thing) short of putting the Island Government in receivership, sending in the marines to maintain order, hordes of attorneys from the DOJ to prosecute, and repealing the Jones Act. Puerto Ricans are statutory citizens of the U.S. That status does not convey all the same rights as native born, or naturalized, U.S. Citizens. Their status can be revoked by Statute. The last thing we want to do is allow them Statehood without correction of the underlying problems that caused the crisis. It would be like adopting Haiti. (The Island of Puerto Rico itself has vast underused natural resources.)
Younger, educated Puerto Ricans are leaving the Island in droves, exacerbating the Island's problems.
We should mandate that English be taught in their public schools, after we pass a law making English the official language of the U.S.
Puerto Rico has a lot of problems just like you illustrated.
But if it became a state, it would be more visible to the rest of the country, the corrupt politicians would be prosecuted and the real estate values would soar with all the new construction.
Everything you say is true, except you failed to mention that all it takes is Congressional action to suspend Posse Comitatus in any particular case, and the President can , and has, suspended Posse Comitatus with an executive order. It would be a trivial matter to do it in the case of Puerto Rico, if the U.S. Government decided to put the Island in receivership.Dominican Republic, literally half of the same island as Haiti (and the half closer to PR, by the way), isn't another Haiti. So it's a little bit of hyperbole to say that PR would become one of the poorest nations in the hemisphere, now isn't it? Also, you might want to brush up on the Posse Comitatus Act, sending in Marines to maintain order has been illegal since 1878. In fact it's one of the things that separate us from the banana republics, ironic you should call to ignore it while warning that PR will become a banana republic! Apart from that, the corruption cleanup definitely needs to be part of any bailout package.
When was this ever done? The President can't overturn a law with an executive order. There was a brief time during the Bush administration when the Insurrection Act was changed to allow some limited executive override of Posse Comitatus but that has since been repealed and was never used. Believe me, I sat through a week of Defense Support for Civil Authorities class; the exceptions to PC are very narrow and what you describe doesn't even remotely fall into them. You're probably confusing National Guard called up under state authority by their governor under Title 32 acting in their own state or an adjacent state at the request of that state's governor (or maybe a movie where the President sternly decided "send in the Marines", but too late to stop the zombie apocalypse). Clearly that wouldn't apply to Marines and wouldn't really work if you're worried about in-state corruption. Not to mention the Marines are almost entirely untrained and unequipped to perform domestic law enforcement or law enforcement of any kind so it would be a spectacularly bad idea to assign them that role. Point being this is a serious situation that could use serious, thought out answers.the President can , and has, suspended Posse Comitatus with an executive order. It would be a trivial matter to do it in the case of Puerto Rico, if the U.S. Government decided to put the Island in receivership.
Dominican Republic, literally half of the same island as Haiti (and the half closer to PR, by the way), isn't another Haiti. So it's a little bit of hyperbole to say that PR would become one of the poorest nations in the hemisphere, now isn't it? Also, you might want to brush up on the Posse Comitatus Act, sending in Marines to maintain order has been illegal since 1878. In fact it's one of the things that separate us from the banana republics, ironic you should call to ignore it while warning that PR will become a banana republic! Apart from that, the corruption cleanup definitely needs to be part of any bailout package.
Or no Bailout package, not make them a 51st state is the best option. Why add a state that does not generate positive economic output? Makes absolute no sense.
May very well be the case. Too bad we can't jettison all the other states that don't generate positive economic output, that would cut out most of the red states!Or no Bailout package, not make them a 51st state is the best option. Why add a state that does not generate positive economic output? Makes absolute no sense.
You are right of course, the President can't legally overturn a law with an executive order. They can simply invoke the law with an order, or order an action to which no law applies! They can do this, and they have. And I am not confusing U.S. Troops with the National Guard.. The original act doesn't even apply to territories. Here is just one of the exceptions to Posse, even domestic!, allowed by law!: 1957 Eisenhower, troops to the Deep South. ( The Enforcement Act allowed many exceptions.*) Also, Changes in the P.C. Act were incorporated in the 2007 Defense Auth. Act -- Bush) In fact you've made me realize there would be no legal impediment at all if the President tomorrow wanted to order U.S. Troops to go into Puerto Rico to maintain order. If he wanted to send them to Montana, that might raise eyebrows, but certainly not to Puerto Rico. Welcome to the U.S. Police State.When was this ever done? The President can't overturn a law with an executive order. There was a brief time during the Bush administration when the Insurrection Act was changed to allow some limited executive override of Posse Comitatus but that has since been repealed and was never used. Believe me, I sat through a week of Defense Support for Civil Authorities class; the exceptions to PC are very narrow and what you describe doesn't even remotely fall into them. You're probably confusing National Guard called up under state authority by their governor under Title 32 acting in their own state or an adjacent state at the request of that state's governor (or maybe a movie where the President sternly decided "send in the Marines", but too late to stop the zombie apocalypse). Clearly that wouldn't apply to Marines and wouldn't really work if you're worried about in-state corruption. Not to mention the Marines are almost entirely untrained and unequipped to perform domestic law enforcement or law enforcement of any kind so it would be a spectacularly bad idea to assign them that role. Point being this is a serious situation that could use serious, thought out answers.
From Wiki.
*The Enforcement Acts, among other powers, allow the President to call up military forces when state authorities are either unable or unwilling to suppress violence that is in opposition to the constitutional rights of the people.
Sig, it is just like we can't go to war without Congress declaring war. Yah, right!
Not only is it my position that there is no real legal impediment to sending U.S. Troops to Puerto Rico, but I am suggesting that that would be necessary if the U.S. was to put the Island into receivership, since the Island police are thoroughly corrupt, and the P.R. National Guard could not be depended upon. It would be a horrible development to grant Statehood; yet leave the mess in place. I don't think Statehood should even be considered until the Puerto Ricans have demonstrated for a decade or two that they are capable of managing their own affairs, and then of course they would likely prefer to remain independent.
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