1984 ?

Originally posted by bungrider
Is it just me, or is the US becoming more and more like Orwell's 1984 every single day?

If you don't recall or haven't read it, the nations of 1984 are constantly at war with each other, and the only reason for it (and there's no way of knowing if the other nations actually exist in the book) is because it keeps the people focused on what their leaders want them to focus on.

Here we have wars against poor countries that we have no way of winning, since those countries don't really have any "targets" worth attacking. So these "wars" go on and on and on with no progress, while we, as a nation, band together and support our leaders and ignore any questioning into the basis for that war.

We also have a push for ID cards from those same leaders. In 1984, the citizens are tracked relentlessly and watched closely by their leaders. How far off will GPS-embedded ID cards be???

I'd also make a comment about how in 1984, the leaders are constantly reducing the breadth of language, removing words that aren't absolutely necessary (i.e. excellent was removed and replaced with "double-plus good"), but aside from W's vocabulary being at about the 12th grade level, I haven't seen any evidence for this just yet...

Comments are welcome...the political discussions here have been really good lately.

It is here now ...
 
Originally posted by jbtrader23

Yet on MTV, it is so perverse, you'd think most people were living like that. Name another industry in which less than 1% of the total population has this kind influence.

Country music is a big seller. But you'd never know it if all you watched was MTV.

That is my point: the powers in control of these corporations, for whatever reason, have decided they favor a particular type of entertainment, ergo that is what is presented, to the exclusion of others. The same may hold true for particular political causes or cantidates, and is especially serious given the gullibility and naivete' of their target audience.

This would be fine if all viewpoints were presented equally and all speakers had equal opportunity -- the danger comes in when there are only 5 boards of directors making moral and ideological judgements on behalf of 300 million people.

The counterargument is that they are just serving the needs of the market, and if the market wanted different it would demand it. That argument fails the threshold test. The people will tolerate what they do not want, so long as the displeasure is below the cost to change it -- e.g., the tax burden in the U.S. is arguably outrageous, but so long as people are allowed to keep enough to be comfortable they will not undertake the revolution necessary to change the system. Same for entertainment and news media - if the disparity is kept below a certain amount, people will accept it rather than revolt against it.
 
people know what people respond to. Most people who say MTV is perverse and Rosie is ridiculous will yet sit glued to their screens when things like this appear. Most of the men who say pornography is degrading still have a hard time not imbibing.

Humans have a base nature. Corporations are constantly mapping it out and pandering to it. Hence the old axiom, 'Sex sells.' The base nature is attracted to the perverse like a magnet is to steel and, I'm sorry, but the monster lives within all of us.

Welp, sorry, but when people abandon the reality of moral absolutes, there is nothing left for them but to sink ever lower morally. Without moral strength, people are powerless to battle against the base nature within all of us.

If corporations, governments, and other institutions are able to influence people in a perverse way, it is by appealing to envy, greed, self righteous, anger, self centeredness, etc. These things are of course the very elements of the base nature.
 
Personally, I don't think we ever really recovered from World War II in terms of how our society operates. Lots of people don't realize it, but the U.S. became a command economy in order to fight the war. We had private ownership, but total government control and support, which is the definition of Fascism. It was "ok" because of the war. After the war, it was supposed to go back. The problem is, there was always another war going on or looming on the horizon. The cold war, Korea, Vietnam, commies in central america, minor dictators ( some of which were created by the CIA ), the drug war, bosnia/serbia, the gulf war, etc. In a way, we have been at "war" since the 1940's.
 
Originally posted by dotslashfuture
Lots of people don't realize it, but the U.S. became a command economy in order to fight the war. ... In a way, we have been at "war" since the 1940's.

excellent point.
 
Originally posted by dotslashfuture
Personally, I don't think we ever really recovered from World War II in terms of how our society operates. Lots of people don't realize it, but the U.S. became a command economy in order to fight the war. We had private ownership, but total government control and support, which is the definition of Fascism. It was "ok" because of the war. After the war, it was supposed to go back. The problem is, there was always another war going on or looming on the horizon. The cold war, Korea, Vietnam, commies in central america, minor dictators ( some of which were created by the CIA ), the drug war, bosnia/serbia, the gulf war, etc. In a way, we have been at "war" since the 1940's.

BS. The US enjoys more economic freedom today then at any time in the past 100 years or so. EVIDENCE dude, give me EVIDENCE!

If the US is a command economy, what the fuck is the rest of the world????

Instead of sitting at your PC with a smug look on your face and putting down the greatest economic system in world history, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IF U DON'T LIKE IT.

Light a candle, don't just curse the darkness!
 
Originally posted by chasinfla


Welp, sorry, but when people abandon the reality of moral absolutes, there is nothing left for them but to sink ever lower morally. Without moral strength, people are powerless to battle against the base nature within all of us.

If corporations, governments, and other institutions are able to influence people in a perverse way, it is by appealing to envy, greed, self righteous, anger, self centeredness, etc. These things are of course the very elements of the base nature.

Chas it's people like you that give me the will to keep talking. "Moral Absolutes" - what drivel. Why not just come out and say you mean "Christian Morals according to the Bible". Your understanding of human nature is fuckin ZERO pal, yet you talk with the pompousness of a intellectual giant.
 
Originally posted by chasinfla
in the above posts, 'corporations' ought to be replaced with 'those greedy for gain and power.'

...then how do you distinguish corporations from individuals?? maybe they should replace 'corporations' with 'CEOs' - then there will be a distinction between greedy folks in business, and greedy folks in everything else...

:D
 
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