10% unemployment but H1B visas accelerating

[syswizard]

Quote from gwb-trading:


According to your math there are 3 to 4 million IT workers in the U.S.; this means that 25% to 33% of the IT workers in the U.S. are visa holders rather than citizens. This is an assertion that mirrors what I see in the workplace.

I surveyed the staffing of the employment agencies while on-contract at JP Morgan. They exposed all of the names of all of the employees of the agencies they use for staffing.
By identifying the names of the personnel, I was able to determine that these agencies had 30% to 50% foreigners on their payrolls.
BTW: this is a huge secret....shhhhh.

 

[gwb-trading]

Quote from LeeD:

Surely, most of those who came to the US 10 years ago either moved to another country or obtained US citizenship. They may have been born outside the US but they are US citizens now...

The initial H1-B Visa is for 3 years. The renewal is for 3 years. Renewals do not count towards the 65K yearly limit. Most H1-B immigrants become green card holders after the 6 year mark. Most do not become U.S. Citizens even after 10 years in the country; this allows them to return to India if they desire in the very long term for retirement. The majority do not return to the India or whatever country they came from when their H1-B Visa expires.

So in summary if there are 3 to 4 million IT workers in the U.S. then Visa holders account for 25% to 33% of the total. The large majority of these are from India. Over a million have come to the U.S. over the past 10 years under the H1-B and other visa programs.

Take a look at the Wikipedia link that I posted if you want more information.

 

[gwb-trading]

Quote from Burtakus:

In many respects too dumb, not motivated enough, not qualified enough, or too expensive.

Add all of that up and it's not a good day for American workers.

I do know several tech workers who are American and get paid very well. But they are highly educated, work their butts off, and have a skill set that is in high demand with short supply.

I know many imported Visa workers who are lazy, have fake degrees, are paid poorly, and are nearly worthless on the job. (Just using the assertion to make a point)

In other words - the broad assertion you are making that U.S. workers are "too dumb, not motivated enough, not qualified enough, or too expensive" is absurd.

The issue here is that corporations are bringing in IT workers from overseas on visas and effectively sentencing them to "indentured servitude" - the workers can not change employers -- and the employers are normally paying them well under what an equivalent U.S. worker earns.

Do you want to fix the Visa system to make it "free market" then allow H1-B Visa workers to switch employers at will? This will clear up a number of issues with the system - then all IT workers in the U.S. will be free to move to an employer paying more money.

 

[Random.Capital]

Quote from gwb-trading:

Do you want to fix the Visa system to make it "free market" then allow H1-B Visa workers to switch employers at will?

Absolutely, yes, that change should be implemented ASAP.

 

[sle]

Quote from gwb-trading:
I know many imported Visa workers who are lazy, have fake degrees, are paid poorly, and are nearly worthless on the job. (Just using the assertion to make a point)

That's a truism. The majority of people are lazy, have no education or have a worthless degree and are nearly worthless on the job. As a result they are paid poorly. While everyone agrees that there is an employment crisis, it's surprisingly difficult to find good and honest professionals in any field. I am not even talking about computer science, biotech or finance, we're talking plumbers, electricians and contractors here. I am trying to do renovations right now and you would be shocked at some of the stories I can tell you.

Anyway, it appears that the more mathematical/scientific any given specialty is, the more it is dominated foreigners. Case in point - most quant trading or quant modelling groups in major banks. The quant group that services me (I run an equity index options desk), has 3 Russians, 3 Frenchman, 1 Palestinian, one Israeli and a token American. All of these people are most certainly well paid (they are the 1% that OWS likes to chant about) and most certainly some of them where or are on H1B visas. However, there just are no Americans qualified for the job.

 

[Lucrum]

Quote from sle:

...it's surprisingly difficult to find good and honest professionals in any field....

I seem to be hearing this a lot lately.

 

[rew]

Quote from Random.Capital:

Everybody loves free markets until its their neck on the chopping block.

And your neck is one I'd be happy to see on the chopping block. Then we'd see just how much in favor of free markets you are.

 

[rew]

Quote from sle:

Considering that there are anywhere from 3 to 4 million IT professionals in the US, 60 thousand jobs are just shy of two percent. Do you really believe that the slope of the demand curve is so steep that a two percent change in supply will have a material effect on the equilibrium and thus, on the compensation?

There are a lot more than 60,000 H-1b workers in this country. Remember, 60,000 is the annual quota. But H-1b workers accumulate.

 

[dcvtss]

Quote from Random.Capital:

Absolutely, yes, that change should be implemented ASAP.

They do switch employers, how it works is they are contractors or sub-contractors, they are actually employed by a company owned by an Indian who may or may not be a US citizen, this company's sole function is to hold the visa for them, in return the company takes a cut of their bill rate off the top. I work in IT and am currently and have in the past worked with some of them, the big public owned IT staffing firms (northrop, lockheed, IBM etc) will use them wherever they can because they pay them less. Like US workers, some are better than others but the cultural differences are always there and can be difficult and irritating and the lost productivity from miscommunications is another part of their cost that is seldom accounted for.

 

[RewriteQuran]

your half-life as a worker in corporate America is about age thirty-five. Around that time, interviews get tougher. Your obligations make you less open to relocation, the technologies on your resume seem less-current, and your ability find that next gig begins to decrease.' By thirty-five, half the folks who started in technology have gone on to something else — perhaps management, consulting, on to roles in 'the business' or in operations. '
http://tech.slashdot.org/story/11/12/03/1435217/half-life-of-a-tech-worker-15-years