1/4% Tax on all stock trades pushed in NY Times today

pescador · Jan 22, 2012

Quote from Explorer:

PARIS, Jan 22 (Reuters) - Europe's proposal for a tax on financial transactions would not apply to bonds issues by governments because states need to be able to finance themselves, said France's Finance Minister Francois Baroin on Sunday.[...]

https://research.tdwaterhouse.ca/research/public/Markets/NewsArticle/1314-nWEA8833-1

Yes. This amounts to an indirect aknowledgement of the fact that other markets, where the tax will be applied, wil have no liquidity remaining.

sculptor66 · Jan 22, 2012

Quote from pescador:

Yes. This amounts to an indirect aknowledgement of the fact that other markets, where the tax will be applied, wil have no liquidity remaining.

Even more, it aknowledges that they don't care if private enterprises are no longer able to finance themselves.

Which means that they don't care if the whole economy goes to shit if they only can expand their own power.

sculptor66 · Jan 22, 2012

Quote from pescador:

It is derogatory mainly in the US. In Europe generally this is not the case at all.
On the contrary, trying to discredit it by calling it "socialist" might very well backfire, leaving you
with an image of a right-wing fanatic, who is against common people.

p..

Absolutely true.

tortoise · Jan 22, 2012

thanks, tom. climbing back on the horse...

Quote from tomdavis:

You're right. The hoodies have successfully propagated two evocative FTT messages:

1) The FTT will make the evil bankers pay for the mess they've made.
2) The FTT will raise untold trillions to end poverty and global warming.

I know this first-hand from talking to parents of my kids' friends, a couple of whom are/were fanatical supporters of the FTT. When they're shown: (a) banks don't pay, but rather investors and pension funds pick up the tab; (b) the FTT generates some revenues but income taxes and business taxes fall due to lower GDP and higher unemployment therby offsetting the gains from the FTT; and, (c) "progressive-liberal" countries like Sweden, Denmark, Australia and Canada are against it -- once they see these things, they begin to question what they've been told.

We can't change everybody's minds, but we can change some minds, and we can inform those who are just coming to the party.

I'll be sending you a PM as a follow up.

TraDaToR · Jan 23, 2012

Quote from FightTheFuture:

"Declaring that his real enemy was âfinanceâ, he backed a financial transactions tax"

There is no other country where a presidential candidate can say such a thing, "Working people who are financing our economy are our enemies"...Don't worry, when your tax will be in place, they won't be your enemies anymore, nobody will touch french products...

Baroin said yesterday that the french tax will be on stocks and derivatives and applied on any french product by origin. I wonder in which extent they can enforce this...Can a country claim intellectual property on an index for example? Indexes are generally the property of companies who create them( SÂ§P, Goldman, Jefferies...) which are not necessarily french. What if Goldman creates a french stocks index or even a proxy?

Perhaps for stocks it's possible. For bonds it would be but they want to exempt it.

Well in any case, they will end up with plethora of trials for any substitute created, the spending for this will be outrageous.

PS: If there are exchange officials reading this thread, I and I am sure others will soon need a substitute for french wheat futures to trade USDA reports.

Explorer · Jan 23, 2012

(google translate)
The finance ministers of Germany and France will meet in Paris today for talks on a joint income tax and a tax on transactions.

The Minister of Finance Germany and France are now in Paris come together to discuss a common corporate tax and a transaction tax. Wolfgang SchÃ¤uble (CDU) and his French counterpart FranÃ§ois Baroin want their results Chancellor Angela Merkel (CDU) and President Nicolas Sarkozy submit a Green Paper.

Merkel and Sarkozy had decided mid-August, 2013 a "joint" tax introduced. The Minister will therefore also discuss the current crisis in the euro zone.

http://www.otz.de/startseite/detail...nd-Frankreich-beraten-ueber-Steuern-267711378

sheda · Jan 23, 2012

Britain will end up paying the European Unionâs financial transaction tax whether it joins the scheme or not, the blocâs top tax official has warned, but it would not receive the proceeds of the levy imposed in the rest of the EU if it continues to veto its entry into force.

Algirdas Semeta, the blocâs tax commissioner, said Londonâs continued reticence to agree to an EU-wide Tobin tax would result in the City paying money to continental tax collectors without Britain benefiting from the proceeds

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/621c6d8c-4519-11e1-be2b-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1kHLvIBaq

sheda · Jan 23, 2012

Mr Semeta also said a new impact assessment carried out by the Commission would show that an FTT would have a ânegligibleâ impact on growth â once assumptions about the economic benefits of the resulting government spending were taken into account. A previous assessment had warned of a 1.8 per cent dent in EU economic output in the long term. [/B]

Ah there going to do some magic with a second assement now.

bjw · Jan 23, 2012

Quote from pescador:

It is derogatory mainly in the US. In Europe generally this is not the case at all.
On the contrary, trying to discredit it by calling it "socialist" might very well backfire, leaving you
with an image of a right-wing fanatic, who is against common people.

We have to win this with real arguments appealing to common sense, instead of by an ideological debate.

Let the propaganda for those who have no real arguments, and let's dismantle their propaganda. as cheap lies.

p..

+1. Excellent post!

ksharmon · Jan 23, 2012

Danish Economy Minister Skeptical About Tobin Tax

Denmark's government is skeptical about the introduction of a financial transaction tax, or 'Tobin' tax, in Europe, Economy Minister Margrethe Vestager said on business news channel CNBC Monday.

The current European proposal for a financial transaction tax would risk hurting growth and jobs, Vestager said, adding that other regulatory measures such as capital and liquidity rules for banks are "much more important."

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120123-702121.html