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Pretty much agree on all points. JB

EXACTLY!!! *Nowhere* does that statement even COMPARE the two events, let alone say that "Abu Ghraib was just as bad an event as 9/11" If you can read the english language he is clearly comparing the *effect of the pictures* and even then he immediately qualifies and says they are not...

Mav: >He said that Abu Ghraib was just as bad >an event as 9/11?!?!!?!?!? WTF! What is >this guy smoking? Actually what are you smoking Mav? The guy NEVER said or intimated any such thing. JB PS, the challenge is to you now to back up your assertion.

Same question to Surf as to Mav: >I'm guessing from your position that you could have an egg >in one vial and sperm in another and leave them both on the >lab counter until next week (to die) with no guilt. However, >as your last act on friday if you dropped them both into the >petri...

Ok, fair enough. Yes, it was an extreme example but it did elicit a statement from you that perhaps you can use to understand mine and others positions (not asking for agreement, only an attempt at understanding). You say: >...although I'm sure there must be some sort of >incubation...

Mav: >Any termination after that point in my mind is >playing God with a life of another human being. Another question here. I'm wondering if you really mean "playing God" in the semi-literal sense of "only God should decide who lives and dies", or if you are simply using the term as a...

Ok, that is a perfectly fine position, but it IS inconsistent with a "life begins at conception" position. In my crude example conception takes place on the counter in the petri dish (this is not a purely theoretical discussion, these out of womb fertilizations happen regularly) Again, there...

I agree...your statement was perfectly benign. I simply wanted to ensure that I didn't misinterpret it. JB

It wasn't a loaded question. I was truly trying to determine whether you were saying those professions were having trouble defining it or whether you were asserting that they had come to the wrong conclusions. Often a statement such as "don't expect them to answer that for you..." simply...

>To explain what is "life" and the stronger >"living individual" appears to elude this category >of professionals. Not sure I follow...care to elaborate? JB

It would certainly effect those of us trading in tax deferred accounts (which are cash only) of any size. JB

Well, that is my whole question to you. Did murder or illegal detention occur? I'm just trying to determine in a lab situation when you feel that "protected human life" (my term) begins. I'm guessing from your position that you could have an egg in one vial and sperm in another and...

Apparently you missed the word "fertilized". Try again. JB

He thinks I was serious. JB PS: How can you NOT know that the 1960 master plan is over 40 years old? And when was the war of 1812 fought?

From previous post:

Wags: >The 1960 Master Plan for higher education >has been around for over 4 decades. No shit? I had no idea it had been around that long. I've only been here for the last 25 so I guess I can be forgiven for not knowing that. JB

Wags: >Not to change the subject, but I find it interesting that >you actually believe that the current Bush Administration >has shown itself to be an arbiter of "fiscal-restraint". You >also go on to say that there is not a shred of evidence to >prove otherwise. Now that's pretty...

And I'll throw you for another loop soon enough with something from the left. I'm a mix and match sort of guy that defies labels. JB

Wags: >So when you talk about fiscal responsibility, I >guess you are saying that you are quite happy >with the fiscal restraint that George Bush >has shown us in the past couple of years? Wag's, it just makes you look STUPID to intimate something that you can't find a shred of...

You clearly see it as the governments responsiblity to educate my children. I clearly see it as mine. JB