Search results

PERSEUS, you cannot make up definitions to further your point zero sum MEANS something it was defined, and created, many years ago as a concept in game theory. if you don't like the term, that's groovy, but it does not change what zero sum means the issue is not "are futures markets...

perseus, the issue isn't "are the markets as a whole zero sum?" clearly, THEY ARE NOT the issue is - are the futures market zero sum. they ARE is the stock market zero sum? no an individual investor is irrelevant. an investor/trader cannot be measured in the terms "zero sum"...

"anyway, traders and econ professors have been debating this for well over a century. " um, no. no trader who understands markets "debates" this. it is non-debatable. it is a structure of the market certainty. i am a trader. i am also an investor. that's irrelevant. futures are zero...

correct why do we keep repeating ourselves for every long futures position, there is an offsetting short - in futures that is what makes it zero sum. in futures, you are trading a CONTRACT, an agreement. that's all it is. his comment was (and IS) irrelevant to the fact that...

i appreciate your posts as well. feel the lurv :)

perseus. are you reading what people are writing? what you are saying is completely irrelevant to the fact that futures are zero sum, and stocks are not completely.

well, a 10 pt stop on ES is roughy equivalent to a 100 pt stop on YM that is a position trade, not a daytrade scalp

actually, there are significant differences between the ES and the YM. they are differently weighted, the YM generally ***follows*** the ES, etc. fwiw, i have backtested my setups on both the ES and the YM. even discounting the extra slippage on the ES (whch is signficiant due to its silly...

this thread is amazing. it is incontrovertible that futures are a zero sum game it is incontrovertible that stocks are not fwiw, technically speaking, a zero sum game can still be theoretically a net neutral outcome game, however any system that is NOT a net neutral outcome game (once...

the dow jones is not meaningless. however, it is a rough proxy. as long as people think it has meaning, - it has meaning. that sounds tautological, but the reality is that when people (and institutions) want to buy stocks, the dow is one way they do that - through futures, basket files...

the fact that SOME markets are not a zero sum game (stocks are not, futures are), is a matter of underlying market reality what does this have to do with TRADING? well, next to nothing. it has a heck of a lot to do with the market though. also, it is problematic to conflate investors...

for DJIA here are some #'s current yield is 2.3 %, CURRENT PE is 21, current payout ratio is 43.3, current relative to value range is 123. as an example, if you think DJIA is fairly valued at 5% yield, then the DJIA would have to fall to 5089 :) of course, value is debatable. price...

first of all spike, if it's above 0%, it's not a zero sum game things aren't "kind of " a zero sum game. they either ARE or they aren't furthermore, your DJIA example of compounded return does not take into account of dividends. DJIA stocks tend to pay dividends that EXCEED the average...

spike, you are correct about the stock market but wrong about the futures market. i will explain this again. there is a very significant difference between futures (and options for that matter) and stocks. i have already explained this, but you need ot keep rereading this, and/or read up on...

spike, you are correct about the stock market but wrong about the futures market. i will explain this again. there is a very significant difference between futures (and options for that matter) and stocks. i have already explained this, but you need ot keep rereading this, and/or read up on...

and alan, you left out the most important factor - EMOTION a big determinant in the price discovery process.

"The poor in the US may be fatter for the first time in history, but that does not change the fact that there are more people living under the poverty line in the US than the total US population some 100 years ago." that is irrelevant because the "poverty line" is a relative measure. it also...

a smart trader can admit when his assessment was wrong, and reassess. way to go :)

furthermore, this has nothing to do with making money. this is about the structure of the market. not a how to lesson knowing that an apple is a fruit won't help you bake a pie either but arguing it's a vegetable just makes you look either, just like arguing the stock market is a zero...

it's not what i believe. it is a fact it is definitional, and anybody who understands basic economics/finance will agree there are lots of things that are opinions. heck, the classic joke about two economists applies "on the one hand, on the other hand" etc. but this is not...