I had seen this strategy being promoted by the Optionetics people a few years back. They made the comment that the more size you had on, the more adjustments you could make to the trade and thus the more "profits" that could be harvested. For example if I bought 100 ATM calls and shorted roughly 5000 shares, and made adjustments every .10 up or down I would be better off than the 1 x 2 trader who would just wait for the market to move one way or the other hopefully and take it off. My question is that isn't it all relative? I haven't done any of these trades, but I am curious to know if this is just seminar hype or if people are really doing these and making trading profits on a consistent basis. Thanks
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Long Synthetic Straddles
- Thread starter Broco123
- Start date
There may be some truth to what they say, but this is similar to kind of a "one-sided" straddle or gamma scalping method.
To survive the huge theta losses, you are going to need lots of movement - either big moves down or up, or lots of little moves to try and scalp dimes.
What will happen is like every other trade, that is, sometimes you will get the movement and do nicely, and sometimes you will get beat by the commission, spreads and theta.
I suggest you actually try it, but of course with much smaller size. I have done things like this with the biotech stocks like CHIR, but I typically lose interest after a few weeks and end up around B/E.
But one of these days if I can just get that 40% move...!
To survive the huge theta losses, you are going to need lots of movement - either big moves down or up, or lots of little moves to try and scalp dimes.
What will happen is like every other trade, that is, sometimes you will get the movement and do nicely, and sometimes you will get beat by the commission, spreads and theta.
I suggest you actually try it, but of course with much smaller size. I have done things like this with the biotech stocks like CHIR, but I typically lose interest after a few weeks and end up around B/E.
But one of these days if I can just get that 40% move...!
Quote from Broco123:
I had seen this strategy being promoted by the Optionetics people a few years back. They made the comment that the more size you had on, the more adjustments you could make to the trade and thus the more "profits" that could be harvested. For example if I bought 100 ATM calls and shorted roughly 5000 shares, and made adjustments every .10 up or down I would be better off than the 1 x 2 trader who would just wait for the market to move one way or the other hopefully and take it off. My question is that isn't it all relative? I haven't done any of these trades, but I am curious to know if this is just seminar hype or if people are really doing these and making trading profits on a consistent basis. Thanks
If one bought the calls when IV was low and then closed the position when IV was high after having kept the position as delta neutral as possible, a profit would be possible, if not probable.
Exactly.Quote from Choad:
To survive the huge theta losses, you are going to need lots of movement - either big moves down or up, or lots of little moves to try and scalp dimes.
In other words the actual vol needs to be higher than the implied vol that you purchased.
Riskarb
If you were gamma scalping a long straddle, what delta adjustment limits would you use. And why ?
TIA.
Quote from Profitaker:
Exactly.
In other words the actual vol needs to be higher than the implied vol that you purchased.
Riskarb
If you were gamma scalping a long straddle, what delta adjustment limits would you use. And why ?
TIA.
I've ran fixed-delta stops and daily/weekly deviations -- I prefer to run the hedge at 1/2/3 devs of daily or weekly[back months] implied vol. If using fixed-delta I hedge weakly at 10d, something less that the model-delta.
Using sigmas allows me to ignore how cheap/expensive my gamma are trading. If gammas are pricey, it should be reflected in a loose-hedge based upon implied distro.
Obviously, I tend to steer-clear of vols trading withing 30% of their 52w highs, unless there is a significant micro event.
Surely hedging at a pre-determined sigma event is exactly the same as using a delta limit ?Quote from riskarb:
Using sigmas allows me to ignore how cheap/expensive my gamma are trading.
Can't make sense of that. Any chance you could clarify ?Quote from riskarb:
If gammas are pricey, it should be reflected in a loose-hedge based upon implied distro.
Thanks again.
Quote from Profitaker:
Surely hedging at a pre-determined sigma event is exactly the same as using a delta limit ?
Didn't mean to imply different. It's simply a matter of preference. I prefer to have a daily bracket notation in lieu of listening for a delta-alarm.
Can't make sense of that. Any chance you could clarify ?
Simply that I favor an implied distro/statvol distro. No need to follow fixed delta/gamma, as the implied distro contraction/expansion infers cheap/expensive gamma. Again, it's simply a matter of preference. You can certainly solve for hedges using model-greek output.
Surely hedging at a pre-determined sigma event is exactly the same as using a delta limit ?
Didn't mean to imply different. It's simply a matter of preference. I prefer to have a daily bracket notation in lieu of listening for a delta-alarm.
Can't make sense of that. Any chance you could clarify ?
Simply that I favor an implied distro/statvol distro. No need to follow fixed delta/gamma, as the implied distro contraction/expansion infers cheap/expensive gamma. Again, it's simply a matter of preference. You can certainly solve for hedges using model-greek output.
Cheers.