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I'm not new to "this" and it's a valid question. Economic growth can signal more demand, not less. Sure that is on it's face simplistic, but so are most of the day to day macro explanations for market activity. I don't even necessarily completely subscribe to it (the premise) entirely, I offered...

That's the idea. To generate a psychological dependency on government.

I see, so we're all clear here. Prices don't mean anything, at any point in time. It's just relative changes in priceyness, with no relation to reality or any particularness of thingyness. Just good ol' priceyness. Do I have that right? Lemme know. This is the economics forum right? Hello? Is...

Do you feel that way about gold too, that the price action as of late is not evidence of anything? Serious question.

Ah gotcha. Thought you were speaking to the merit of the content. I see what you mean now.

Glad to see the ETF forum is so hopping around here.

Not sure what you're saying here. I am skeptical as to Lord what's his name's allegations. That said, the whole Copenhagen thing is a joke, the science is lacking and there is a money angle here somewhere. I don't buy a world government or that kind of BS, but I do see how easily these kinds of...

Well I can buy that idea for year end redemptions and profit taking for PnL purposes for hedge funds, etc.

Just saying, with the supposed upturn in the economy, demand for oil should be increasing. Yet oil prices are falling. Yet more evidence that there is real doubt in the market that a lasting recovery is underway?

LOL.

Here you go. http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/dec/08/copenhagen-climate-change

Yeah I get all that but at a certain point (we're possibly already there) there will be no more golden eggs from the goose. You can only tax so much. So then what? And where is the draft? I would like to see the draft that he's supposedly read. I buy this stuff to an extent, but a global...

Yeah, I agree this is more likely true than not. I'm just saying even for me, the ultimate cynic, I found it a bit too much. Btw, where is the draft? If he had it, why hasn't he released it? It sure would support his argument better.

Senate would never ratify this. As bad as they are, this makes them seem like the founding fathers. They have their limits even. I can't understand the point of this. Why would the western developed countries sign on to this? The whole thing doesn't add up. Are we sure Mockton isn't a loon...

Also see here: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=185033 And ignore the troll in that thread.

Ignore my point about correlations being better for XES to CL, that was an error on my part as I was looking at the wrong chart. Correlations are actually slightly stronger for OIH to CL most of the time, but not substantially so.

Discuss amongst your elves (yes, elves): http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=av16pDNNrMig

Ok, the obvious advantage of OIH is no fees, as was pointed out in another thread. Question remains though, why not go with XES? It has a lower minimum investment requirement (OIH requires minimum of 100 lots per order) and it has exceedingly better positive correlation to front month crude...

I wouldn't worry about that. The government is here to help us. They wouldn't do anything like that.

I was referring to the state of the nation shit for brains. But you already knew that.